Weekend Links 12-13 November 2016

Artist : William Dobell (Australia, b.1899, d.1970) Title : Date : 1970 Medium Description: oil on hardboard Dimensions : Credit Line : Purchased 1971 Image Credit Line : Accession Number : 144.1971

The Night of the Pigs, William Dobell, 1970, Art Gallery of NSW




United Kingdom

 United States


Terra Incognita


 Capital Markets

Global Macro

…and furthermore…

Donald Trump (a bit more) and sundry other implications


Vale Leonard Cohen 1934-2016



Latest posts by Gunnamatta (see all)


  1. These f#cking people!

    “Bay area or another, wondering if you would be willing to spend
    some time with Mark Zuckerberg.

    Mark is meeting with people to learn more about next steps for his
    philanthropy and social action and it’s hard to imagine someone better
    placed or more experienced than you to help him. As you may know, he’s
    young and hungry to learn — always in learning mode — and is early in his
    career when it comes to his philanthropic efforts. He’s begun to think
    about whether/how he might want to shape advocacy efforts to support his
    philanthropic priorities and is particularly interested in meeting people
    who could help him understand how to move the needle on the specific public
    policy issues he cares most about. He wants to meet folks who can inform
    his understanding about effective political operations to advance public
    policy goals on social oriented objectives (like immigration, ”


    • and this from Schmidt

      1. Size, Structure and Timing

      Lets assume a total budget of about $1.5Billion, with more than 5000 paid
      employees and million(s) of volunteers. The entire startup ceases
      operation four days after November 8, 2016.

      What a unicorn!!! These fucking people

    • Why don’t they just switch off their ego and alleged social conscience and just pay some tax. Just pay some tax.
      It’s a joke that Zuckerberg thinks he knows what society needs ahead of society. Philanthropy should be illegal.
      Pay tax, give people you allegedly care about money, Invest in democracy rather than your ego. Try that.

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        “Pay tax, give people you allegedly care about money, Invest in democracy rather than your ego. Try that.”

        I like the cut of your jib Sweeper.

      • Have been saying same to all my friends. Remember when Packer paid $9 tax? Packer junior threatened to stop donating to one of Sydney hospitals if msm did not stop hammering the old fart.
        Fucking egomaniacs PAY YOUR FUCKING TAX.

      • Spot on sweeper. Tax deductible donations are an absolute rort and need urgent repeal. It is just another corporate dodge where the elites can flaunt their wealth under the noses of the needy. The irksome issue is that the donator has the choice of to whom the donation is given and more often than not it’s to a crony trust arrangement that has just happens to been given tax deductibility status by the ATO based on what the trust is supposedly going to achieve. Most don’t achieve anything except avoidance of tax and the supposed recipients don’t get dollar for dollar due to massive administration costs. We’ve all heard the stories about Shane Warne who is just the tip of the iceberg. What astounds me is that this is done under the nose of the ATO via the ACNC whose audits and regulatory compliance are an absolute joke. Anyone interested go onto the ACNC website and see the list of charities. It will make your hair white with anger. After the Warne and ASLS fiascos about 15% of the charities were deregistered and 30% haven’t ever filed a return …….. all passe for years until Warne flapped his gob and we found out his gang were having a lavish time on his deductible donations. BTW no one was ever charged. The man/women/gender undefined in the street handing over a donation gains no benefit from the few dollars they hand over, it’s the 1% that get a free ride. Pathetic really …….. so yes, just pay your tax.

  2. http://crooksandliars.com/2016/11/drain-swamp-trump-team-loaded-lobbyists

    On his transition website, Trump has said that he would like to repeal post-crisis regulation Dodd-Frank and also the rule requiring professional investors to put their clients’ interests above their own.

    Who’d a thunk it.

    Sanders would have hired academics, not open the revolving door for Wall Street.

    But is it really a surprise. More than 40% of Americans think the universe was create six to ten thousand years ago. This is a population that is easily duped and lacking in intellectual integrity and curiosity.

    I know they were angry and had a right to be, but did they not think that every word he uttered was lie? Why did they not participate in the primaries. Bill Maher stated that if he had to choose Ted Cruz would be better than Trump.

    Congratulations, some of you predicted the result of the election. Did you predict how quickly the status quo would be reasserted?

    “Americans are the most entertained, least informed people on the planet” – RFK Jr. And they elected a reality show host and failed businessman as the president.

    • Lol, I feel vindicated….

      I always said that about 10% of Americans are smart. They can take you to the moon and back.

      The rest are bloody useless.

      • Ok Pablo. Name one country where smart people represent more than 10% of the total population. Its meant to be a joke in case you go on a mission.. Lol

      • Actually what took America to the moon and kickstarted the science and tech revolution in America was a goose-stepping moron who decided to expel many of the best scientists Central Europe had simply due to either their religion or because they shared a similar surname as people with said religion (at the time the German Empire and France were the scientific epicenters of math, physics and chemistry). That generation that fled as well as their kids (who all seem to be born in Brooklyn) was America´s advantage, sustained by the H1-B visa system. Since then the advantage has been shrinking rapidly and may reverse completely considering the wasp anger and poor level of education of the populace.

    • You won’t get any response from the Trumpkins.

      I always found it funny that the ‘anti-elite’ candidate was a guy born into wealth, who made a business off his fathers coat-tails and lobbying government, obsessed with creating huge monuments to himself, with a long well-documented history of exploiting the poor and illegal immigrant for his own benefit.

      • Trump may be rich. But he’s not one of the elite.

        The elite are left leaning intelligentsia, academics, politicians of the modern progressive persuasion and their multiple media supporters. They collectively frame the debate, set the agenda, stifle or suppress divergent opinion (a media speciality) – deeply convinced of their authority, of their superiority, an unrelenting force intent on engineering society to adapt to their preferences by fair means or foul. Or else.

      • Xo…..

        “The elite are left leaning intelligentsia, academics, politicians of the modern progressive persuasion and their multiple media supporters.”

        Are you completely daft… neoliberalism is a hard right wing agenda to advance a particular preference for both human quantification and the behavior they should ascribe too based off ex nilhilo axioms aka humans – are – thingy and must submit too it.

        Whilst were at it, if your memory is not afflicted by some disorder… academics was monetized by your mob [see Science Mart], politicians where monetized [see Citizens United], the so called progressives are just social libertarians [LBGT] that sold out to neoliberalism [monetized], and as far as the media goes that was consolidated under the auspices of corporatism [monetized]….

        Disheveled Marsupial….. what part about society taking a back seat to the market [Thatcher and Raygun] did you miss dude… this is the culmination of all that moeny and power mobs like FEE and friends spent over some decades… you should be weeping in joy at your stripes triumphs… congratulations mate… or is this some bizarre form of buyers remorse coupled a strange case of the kid crying orphan after killing there parents thingy…. can’t own the deed…

      • lol ‘Xo’ that may be your definition of the elite, based on your hopelessly partisan views, but it’s weak.

        You also forget that Trump was a democrat, spending a lot of time schmoozing at democrat events (including HRC’s wedding).

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        Xo is a propagandist, he knows and understands full and well what you describe Skip,

        The maintaince and support of “society taking a back seat to the market [Thatcher and Raygun]” is the only reason Xo is here.
        He does this with posts that are written quite well, but are full of half truths, obfuscation and contradiction .
        He known the Economic agendas of the Working Class “Left” have been almost completly swept asside, with NO political representation and given NO airtime within the media.
        He knows the ONLY “Left wing” issues “Allowed” to be discussed, by his Plutocratic/Copotate/Consumerist masters are as Skip points out, “Progressive ones,…”the so called progressives are just social libertarians [LBGT] that sold out to neoliberalism [monetized],”.

        The great success of types like Xo, is to convince millions of joe sixpacks to think right of centre political philosophy ( the philosophy of real power eliets) represents their interests.
        This has been helped unfortunately by the “leaders” of the “Left” lazily following the path of least resistance, embracing social and identity issues closely whilst ignoring and refusing to challange the Neoliberal status quo,…when they do this, they are no longer really “Left”, but rather just Carriest, Centerist, Social progressives, who have learnt how fast the media and real elites can shut them down if they start threaten the Economic power structure.
        Power eliets love SJWs and the PC brigade because they keeps the masses divided, thats why Xo spends so much time equating social progressives with “Leftists”.

      • Xo

        Nice “no true scotsman” effort. I think it is pretty obvioius that to just about anyone anywhere in the world Donald Trump is an elite.

    • Too funny, wonder if those buttfuck rednecks who voted for Trump to give Wall Street a kick have realised the worst he’ll do is given them a cuddle and a helping hand to loot what’s left.

  3. Anyone else over aggressive, superior and vituperative comments/responses?

    I am, and I have to restrain myself from stirring the perpetrators. The vengeance visited upon me would not be worth the momentary satisfaction I gain.

    So back to obscure Oz Rock for me, but fuck me I am close to an almighty spray.

    Note Harry is neither right nor left these days. Probably left but not “green” left. More “Ermo” left.

    • After my Achilles injury the other week which left me hobbling around, looking at myself getting into the lift at work in the mirror I realised I have just about completed my transition into my dad.

      • That’s a transition I’ll never be doing as my old man has decided to go feral with a spray tan and a girlfriend lol it’s not pretty

    • ….aussie but not so obscure, I could post some Midnight Oil but… something more contemporary. It was a masterstroke that this album was dropped the week of the election. A concept album about the fall of civilizations. The video is annoying though (great images but very busy, images flash too quickly, I find that annoying, I’d rather a video tells a story, but that’s me)

      Yes Birds of Tokyo are daggy… but then there is Karnivool. The thinking man’s Birds of Tokyo. A song that was inspired by a dystopian book called The Children of the Earth.


      One of the YT comments is hilarious:
      “chemical fires yes, it has really taken this long to realise that aphantasia excists, the scientist of today are irritatingly behind times and chemical fires and I am here to be studied, I am so tired of the misconceptions of my type. Oh I cant read very long imagery as I have no visual imagery in my minds eye to relate it too. Well me neither, but I love imagery, it gives me a sense and feeling that is better than visuals!”


      • Sorry econo. I know plenty of people who love these bands (esp Karnivool). I have really tried to like them.

        Not one catchy song. Compare to Australian Crawl.

        The best you can say about these bands is that they are highly skilled. The songs on the other hand may have been written by the monkeys who didn’t get to submit the Shakespeare transcript.

        The point is no catchy melody!

      • And sorry, Birds of Tokyo is a fuckin shit band. Shit pointless lyrics and random diatonic steps for song melody.

      • I take your point, i did not post it as a fan of BoT, i posted it as there are not many bands that get political anymore (I mean “mainstream” ones, not ones like Rise Against). And as for the ‘vool song, I posted it for the comment which I thought was funny. Disclaimer: I do have a couple of Vool albums tho. Took me a while but it did grow on me eventually. As for BoT, dont own any.

      • King Crimson – Starless

        Starless by King Crimson. Another taster from the new King Crimson album – “Radical Action to Unseat the Hold of Monkey Mind”.

        As those lucky enough to have seen it live will know, the opening chord of this song are often accompanied by an intake of breath. Like an incoming tide of realisation, all the variations on “I never thought I’d hear this live”, or “crikey, this is my favourite”, “OMG I’ve died and gone to heaven” and a few more sentiments besides.

        The complexities behind capturing the seven-headed Crimson on video are described in David Singleton’s liner notes :

        “It is something of a truism in the history of Crimson that any show that is filmed will not be one when heaven meets earth and the angels descend. The presence of cameras and cameramen iintroduces an intrusive element into the relationship between the artist, the music and the audience. Our solution was to return to the concept of “BootlegTV” and prioritise the music and the performance rather than the pictures. We embedded a single cameraman (the long-suffering Trevor Wilkins) on this tour, and he filmed every night with a a series of cameras hidden discreetly on the stage where they would intrude on neither artist nor audience. The compromise is thus in the visuals and not in the music.”

        The set was recently described by John Kelman in “All about jazz” as “the definitive live Crimson release from the definitive live Crimson lineup; a landmark recording from a group whose discography is filled with them.”


    • Mining BoganMEMBER

      Since chucking the job I’ve been out the back killing time doing up old timber furniture and listening to the bands I haven’t bothered with for years. Died Pretty, Laughing Clowns, Ratcat, Falling Joys, The Saints, Go-Betweens, Regurgitator. It’s been cool. Listen a lot to PBS(106.7Melbourne) as well because it’s the only place I find interesting stuff that pricks my ears. I never wanted to become the old guy who retreated to the music of his youth but here I am. Although, it is good to occasionally find something that I missed, probably due to the copious amount of alcohol drunk.

      Out the back with Jack the dog, stubbie in one hand, sandpaper in the other, listening to Renee Geyer is much nicer than the crap that’s been going on outside. I might not come out for a while.

    • Here’s a track that’s been in my head this whole campaign, ‘Pricks Up Front’

      “Every rock star, movie star, president, pope or czar
      In essence are pubescents shouting ‘Grandpa- Look at me!’
      And must be overcompensated for an ego once deflated
      In a narcissistic injury ‘tween ages one and three.
      As they go grabbin’ up the Grammy or the Emmy or the Obie
      And go blabbing their baloney to a dazzled peasantry
      Don’t ya feel like a stunted underpaid grunt?
      Which you are as the good lord wants
      To be very very clear I’ll be very very blunt
      Towards your metaphysical befuddlement:
      It’s asses to the rear with the excrement.
      God wants the pricks and the cunts up front”

      • I like it – apartment singing is right up my alley – I listened to a few of your other ones too. being able to create anything is a precious gift. You’re gettin around the fretboard pretty good and I loved your chord inversions leading back to the the tonic.

        I tried to post a couple of my JJJ unearthed ones but they keep getting deleted. As I said above, probably for the best as they are somewhat abrasive, believe it or not. One way I guess is this google search (https://www.google.com.au/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=the%20harolds%20unearthed)

      • Are you recording a plugged into acoustic into your interface, and putting vox over the top or just all at once and then chucking reverb on at the end?

      • damn – Harolds – how have I not come across this on Rage?
        You weren’t part of TISM? some elements – so you’re the guitarist? or all>?

        I’m actually a violinist by trade yet got sick of it and gave up music.
        played some songs on piano and guitar there – i guess the only thing of note is that I’m a beginner yet all those songs I didn’t write any lyrics or songs in advance, Just sit down and play something sing something.

        I’m getting better – even managed to do one in my second language korean which shocked the hell out of me with what came out.


        It’s highly subliminal process, it’s also a healing process. The only song I could not upload was when a friend was murdered a few weeks ago, yet it helped me get thru it.

        Thanks for your comments on the guitar – i really have extreme limitations with that instrument – and only stick to what a violinist can do who has no idea really.

      • I have a nice acoustic guitar – a takamine new yorker – i record in my tiled apartment on a SONY USB device which you use to record meetings. I upload it to audacity and add a touch of reverb. That’s it. I”d love to have a multi track device or something nice, yet it goes against my minimalist philosophy
        The monetary reform track I reduced the pitch and speed setting by 10% or so.

      • funny – music breaks your heart but gives you hope.

        you’ve got chords, melody and creativity. keep it going and I guarantee you will surprise yourself. only thing is you might want to get a digital audio workstation or DAW for your computer (although I acknowledge you want to present your art with minimal intervention).

        I look forward to your first single! you might need to do a little EQ work on the individual parts to get to that point. ie vox and guitar on different channels to be mixed together.

        let me know if you want me to be a little more critical too, in terms of music and chords etc.

        as an ex-guitar teacher i am a sucker to help anyone in music. let me know if you need a hand in anything.

      • thanks haroldus, really appreciate the advice and encouragement. This really helps.

        people like yourself who have music and share it are doing a world a huge favour, imagine a world without music… it wouldn’t be a place i’d want to stay around for too long

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      The “Ermo left”?

      Ahhh,…nothing like the Incentive salience that can only come from the Accolades and approbations of others on social media.

      Evcept Cocaine of cource.

      Ermoism, I like the sound of that,..or even better Ermoanity.
      Wasn’t that bloke who started Christianity a Plumber also?

      Cheers Harry


    … note comments on thread …


    The Democrats have said one of their top priorities is to overturn the Supreme Court ruling on Citizens United as money has too much influence in politics.

    They should be cheered by the election result.

    Clinton spent $500 million to $250 million to Trump and lost.

    And the evil Super PACs sent $190 million backing Clinton and only $60 million backing Trump – a 3:1 ratio and he won.

    So they’ve proven that the impact of money on the outcome of elections is quite minor (which is different to zero).

    • TailorTrashMEMBER

      Was a cohen man from the start ………..and what I most liked about him was he aged in a style as graceful as his music ……….when you got it …you got it ! …….a sad loss but he left a mark for the ages ………

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      The clip below pretty much says the same, Thomas Frank giving a good history on how the democrats betrayed and eventually lost the American working class.
      For too long the Democrats have said of the working class, “who else can they go to at election time?”,…well they found someone,…Trump.


  5. I had written an extensive examination on the current Chinese bubbles in USD denominated resources. But then I saw the news that LC had passed away. While I enjoy a wide range of thrash and other equally obnoxious metal, I grew up with an appreciation of the role lyrics played in the total musical experience. So instead of wasting my time posting about the absurdity of Chinese retail investors, I am chilling to a wide range of artists performing the works of LC, from Misstress Barbara to Dylan to Nina Simone. A master of the english language passed away today joining a long list of influences from my early years to have left in the last few years, starting with Chrissy Amphlett and Doc Neeson stretching to Bowie, Prince, and now Leonard Cohen. The word is worse for their loss but a better place for their lives.

  6. Exactly!

    The liberal economic order…. is completely broken down. Utterly broken down.The tools we were using to defeat inflation are still the tools we’re using now to try deal with deflation. They’re not working and they’re not going to work.


    But what Paul Keating (quote above) may not yet have realised , or at least said, is that ‘there is no way forward now, only back’ and it’s a long retracement to 18th March 2009, when the real damage started.

      • Not enough jobs in infrastructure these days, mostly machinery, just money for his construction mates. It will take a trade war to bring the jobs back if he is fair dinkum. The Fed will buy enough of his bonds to give us stagflation first.

        I will be over the moon if General Michael Flynn is National Security Advisor, he and Mr Putin will soon carve up the Middle east in a mutually agreed fashion and let the US rebuild its degraded capacity to project.

      • Forget the US that battle is won, main show is back to Europe and the World Island. EU is already dead but it needs to be broken peice by peice – guaranteed the mainstream media will do the exact same thing again and tell the Italians, the French then ultimately the Germans, that all the polls say blah blah blah don’t believe your lying eyes. It’s all they know to do! And the EU crumbles the entire neolib project will be in the Ash heap. They came close to the new world order – build a wall around the UN building.

      • Mig, “new world order”? As in what exactly? It isn´t like Club Med is being held back by anybody other than the “old world order”. “Some men just want to watch the world burn”

      • “as in what” as in rule by a supranational technocracy under the influence of exploitative bubble finance Jason

      • “…as in rule by a supranational technocracy under the influence of exploitative bubble finance ”
        The US just elected a douche-bag who has lived of crony-capitalism and RE. Nothing has changed because corruption has been around since the beginning of time. Your conspiracy idea that bodies like the UN, FAO or EU are the boogey-man is little more than 36 gauge tin-foil schizophrenia. The boogey-man is humanity and their inability to see the forest for the trees ang being easily lead by populism. The truth is you don´t want to fix anything, you are angry and want to see the world burn. Good luck avoiding the back-draft Elliot.

      • “The boogey-man is humanity”

        Well then lets never do anything about anything, somehow the elites developed these institutions and they’ve made off like bandits wielding them… But, hey whatever, it’s humanity stupid (or is that a tautology?)

      • Mig, what I mean is that we need Roosevelt´s (either one will do fine) not Mussolinis or Stalins. However now I feel it is too late and, as usual, the populace will pay before we get that.

      • FDR WAS a Stalin or Mussolini, look at what he did to get his agenda through – you just like him because along with skip and a few others you liked the agenda . Total hypocrisy as always.

        the other Roosevelt was an idiot man-child off on jungle adventours. . . . Humanity isnt the problem, the ones mind-controlling are

    • There is no way back, just like there is no way forward. Trump can’t really bring back the jobs of the 20th century, same as Hillary or Sanders. The best we can hope for is that the machinery of elite corruption gets derailed enough to allow something better to form on the other side of the economic singularity.

      The old ideas about jobs, manufacturing, wealth and resources just don’t make sense the way they used to. It’s an idea that is virtually impossible to sell to anyone, despite there being evidence of it all around us. A great example is the solar tomato plant down in SA – http://www.smh.com.au/business/kkrbacked-tomatoes-bring-certainty-amid-two-1b-solar-power-plans-20160606-gpd4lz.html

      More and more autonomous “robot” factories that sit there and quietly make stuff. Tomatoes today, clothes clothes next year, and then eventually all the other bits and pieces in Big W. It is a future that contradicts most basic principles of money and commerce. That is the big crisis facing us – the future is both inevitable and unthinkable. There is probably no way to have a smooth transition to a new order where the wealth people spent a lifetime accumulating is not really worth much. One thing that can’t be automated is land, however if the value of all the other commodities is degraded, then how do you assign ownership of land other than by a feudal system of assigned privilege? How do you stop the dispossessed from taking it by force? How do you pay an army to protect your property when the soldiers can have as many free solar tomatoes as they want? Everyone wants to believe that the future is just a variation of the recent past – which is true until it’s not true.

      • So what will work in the future?

        The only thing that has shown potential to me is the capturing of rents and a UBI. But, these are drastic. That makes them hard to sell and also easy to beat down with fallacious arguments. Added to this is that a UBI really grates against the protestant values system. It is seen as rewarding those who do nothing, yet this is exactly what already happens in our rent seeking world. The difference is that those who are currently do nothing and reaping the rewards are considered to be the business heroes of today.

        Can anyone see any other alternate paths?

      • “There is no way back, just like there is no way forward”.

        Branco Milanovic might agree with you regarding the way back. He describes the four challenges to a return to the narrative the centre left ‘think’ they occupy here

        More importantly he asks the question as to what the new thinking could be?

        Neoclassical economics is not bothered with this thinking but the heterodox appear to be. When the penny drops it may just derive from the contradictions of a monetary market system and the autonomous technology you describe.

      • Strangely enough, the answer is hiding in plain sight. Our idea of an economy is a volatile construct of recent civilization. In fact an economy is essentially a complex organised system that doesn’t collapse on itself. Our notion of stability is measured in decades or at best centuries, but look at the natural world and there are “economies” that have time frames measured in millions of years. Think about the age of the dinosaurs – T Rex was not around for long – only about 10m years, but others had a much longer run. These were complex biological systems that managed to avoid collapse for millions of years, so they must have been doing something right.

        You won’t find mainstream economists thinking about these things as they are too focused on the mechanics of finance and markets. Erwin Schrodinger may or may not have had a cat, but despite this he wrote about the mysterious way complex systems defy thermodynamics by increasing or maintaining complexity – https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negentropy. This preceded the discovery of DNA which showed the machinery that biological systems use to exclude entropy. Complex systems that last millions of years require a Negative Entropy Pump to keep them on the straight and narrow. To use a nautical analogy, a negative entropy pump for a complex system is like a bilge pump for a leaky boat. This is probably a very long way away from how economists think.

      • interested partyMEMBER


        1…. “Strangely enough, the answer is hiding in plain sight.”

        Yes it is.

        2…. “These were complex biological systems that managed to avoid collapse for millions of years, so they must have been doing something right.”

        Yet we simplify through technology and wonder why the results are sub-optimal.

        3…. “You won’t find mainstream economists thinking about these things as they are too focused on the mechanics of finance and markets.”

        Blinkered views. Economists should study biology/zoology and natural system dynamics before producing opinions to be shared with society.

        I am very interested in readers interpretations of “sustainability”.

      • Please keep biology out of economics. Economic and social “Darwinism” have already done enough damage to the evolutionary science. In any case there are plenty of stable, sustainable natural systems that most people would reject (think social insects for example). Economics is a question of morality and resource utilization rather than biology.

      • “Please keep biology out of economics. Economic and social “Darwinism” have already done enough damage to the evolutionary science. In any case there are plenty of stable, sustainable natural systems that most people would reject (think social insects for example). Economics is a question of morality and resource utilization rather than biology.”

        This is not a very well constructed reply. It is the sort of thinking that belongs back in the Dark Ages. Insisting that Economics has no basis in the principles of mathematics, but is in fact a hybrid of word soup and commodity trading – is just not going to work. That is one of the reasons we are in the mess we are in at the moment. Economics has been hijacked by lawyers, politicians, journalists, merchants and academics who can spin up a vaguely plausible story about whats up. Paul Krugman would be a good example of this.

        “resource utilization rather than biology” Do you realize how silly this is? Biology is the master class in resource utilization. Economics is our attempt to apply something like the strategies of the natural world to human affairs. Unfortunately, we have a long way to go because the underlying principles at work in the world around us involve mathematical concepts which are either very new or undiscovered.

        And Skippy agrees with the intellectual stone age point of view!!?? Skippy – do you actually analyze the vast swathes of words you regurgitate? Its all very well to cut and paste word soup, but digesting it and uncovering meaning and ideas is actually hard work.

      • DarkMatter….

        My comment is in reference to the last 50ish years of econnomics e.g. presume a thing and then apply that perspective to all and sundry or worse reverse engineer a methodology to arrive at a predetermined ideological preference and proclaim it truth.

        Now I’m not saying economics [actually sociopolitical social science] can’t be reformed and that is my fervent hope, but for the love of all life on this orb lets not mingle royal science with the dark arts or at least incorporate the new knowlage gained post dead authors out of antiquity and not repeat Spencer’s ilks failures….

        Disheveled Marsupial….. presently economics has not risk weighted AGW and all its multidisciplinary side effect besides the neoclassical green washing… science…. groan….

      • interested partyMEMBER

        DM, I took it at face value that JasonMnan was pleading to not drag Biol into the pig pen with econ…… where-as, I want that outcome. Econ is in dire need of a reality injection. I also took it skips reply was as above as well. Could have read them wrong though….
        I don’t agree that Economics is a question of morality and resource utilisation … maybe in it’s purest form…. but we don’t have that. We have economics as a question of profit and resource exploitation, with humanity included as a resource.

        The only thing that stacks up in all this madness is permaculture. It is in harmony with natural systems. The system is fracturing….. and the clock still ticks on.

        PS…. good post above by the way. Plenty there to consider. Thanks.

        I also note that all have avoided the elephant….. very telling.

      • interested partyMEMBER

        Skip, I need to counter this.

        “Now I’m not saying economics [actually sociopolitical social science] can’t be reformed and that is my fervent hope, but for the love of all life on this orb lets not mingle royal science with the dark arts “

        Care to share this reform you envision? You bang on adnauseum about the how and when said dark art became so convoluted ( correctly I will add )…..so pony up and tell us the fix.

        My take?

        The only lasting reform is one that is based in TRUE sustainability ( you know… that concept that most can’t face ) and as DM has well stated above, there is no better master to learn from than the natural systems … ergo…Biology and Zoology. I am surprised that you think otherwise. But in the end…. it will come to be this way and we can decide to employ the strategies available willingly…. or they will be forced upon us eventually.

  7. A third night of protests in the US with some destruction of property, I guess the Protestors only like democracy when it falls in their favour. I am sure citizens in places like China and Vietnam would kill to be given freedom on who to vote for.

      • American skippy, best I could find of Bernie protests was from RT on the day of the RNC primaries with one or two getting pepper sprayed trying to break down a barrier. No kettles, nothing like the Occupy protests – looks like you’re talking out your tail again.

      • Merk….

        How do you think people would respond after what happened to occupy or have you forgotten the Bonus Army marches results….

      • American skippy, the Bonus Army was in 1932. I hadn’t forgotten them, I wasn’t even alive at the time and I’m willing to bet that neither were you. The Bernie Bros were a bunch of unmotivated cowards compared to the Bonus Army, whom Wikipedia credits with contributing to the incumbent President (Hoover) losing in a landslide to FDR.
        Dishevelled Marsupial… the Bernie Bros barely protested and accepted the theft of the Dem Candidacy by Hillary like a bunch of wimps. Quit dissembling, accept it and MoveOn.

      • Would’ve been interesting had it been a Sanders Trump contest.

        HRC was boring, predictable and said nothngbto havent heard a politcal say before. And then she took on bad advice and started banging on about women, women, women. Turned non urban blokes off and their womenfolk too 😉

      • merk….

        Not much anyone in the Sanders camp could do about the DNC sabotage and lest we forget Sanders is an independent that ran as a democrat. The point that was made is what do some people expect considering very public paramilitary put downs of demonstrations [17 city’s] by the national security apparatus. Sorry it seems a little arm chair to think the shrinking middle class or working class will rise up and – ???? – when most don’t even have the foggiest clue. This is the difference between the Bonus Army marchers, ex combat vets and families, yet what was the outcome of that parade.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. this rolls back to the perception that 2nd amendment rights with some gold and beverages will somehow render those immunity….

    • I thought the same powermonger when watching the news this morning. Citizens exercising their democratic right to protest about people exercising their democratic right to vote. But it’s quickly descended into riots which are not at all democratic but just outright mob rule. I think the point is lost on these people that are bitterly complaining and acting badly. A bit like the Brexit shenanigans going on to try for another referendum for pete’s sake!
      I was however surprised at the soft response by the authorities or at least it seemed that way from the footage. Curious that!

      • Well, before the election, Trump deliberately made the point that the system was rigged, and that he’d only accept the outcome if he won.

        So, he now expects other people to accept the outcome? Really?

        Trumpkins are getting a bit of their own rhetoric flung back at them.

        It won’t last long.

        I see that Trump is already giving plum government jobs to his kids. Hahaha.

      • Nothing rhetorical about a riot. Want to condemn the white guy getting lynched in Chicago? Deplorable.
        Hillary and Obama have disgraced themselves further by not condemning these riots, in fact they could be accused of dog-whistling, rallying their snowflakes ‘not to give up’ and ‘do the right thing’.
        As for ‘plum government jobs’, it’s in his transition team. Who would you advise him to recruit, all the people on his own side who said he was unfit for office?
        I would have never voted for Trump but I wish him all the best; the nation he wants to govern is being wrought apart by Marxist ideologues with a dangerous bent towards self-righteousness and intolerance. He’s still the underdog and I hope he succeeds.

      • I agree with you merk. I was trying to point out that if one side of politics plays by a particular set of rules, then don’t be surprised if the other side adopts the same rules. I was not implying that I thought it a good thing.

        As for Hillary. Well, she lost, Trump won. So why should she have anything to say about it? It’s not her problem any more. Same with Obama. He’s going. Not going to be his problem. Let Trump and the Congress deal with it.

        If a particular set of tactics won, and voters were convinced by those tactics, surely the other side will adopt them soon enough.

        That you or I don’t like them doesn’t matter. The voters approved, it’s a democracy, that’s the new polity.

      • “the nation he wants to govern is being wrought apart by Marxist ideologues with a dangerous bent towards self-righteousness and intolerance.”

        Evidence please…. strangely enough all the economic and policy advisors for decades have been right wing starting with Carters big toe, Rayguns full immersion, and Clinton’s breathing underwater, only to have both Bushes evolve fins and gills, then the Obamametronome siren beguile the unwashed….

        Disheveled Marsupial…. please point out these Marxist by name and position and how they effected policy….

      • Yes i would like to hear more about who these powerfull Marxists are?

        He means “Cultural Marxists”, aka “Critical Theory”, aka Frankfurt School, aka “The Jews”.

        The singers might change, but the song remains the same.

      • Oh Dear. Smithy you are getting desperate now. Critical Theory = Anti-semitism. What next? Jeff Koons’ Rabbit = Islamophobia?

      • Oh Dear. Smithy you are getting desperate now.

        LOL. From the guy whose hallmarks of the apocalypse are uppity wimmins and men using the ladies dunnies.

      • “men using the ladies dunnies.” sounds like discrimination you virtue signalling hyper tard. Let’s Black & whites dunnies too

      • Marxist ideologues, well let’s see, Saul Alinsky and his acolytes, Obama and Clinton, who are still in leadership and looking the other way while their supporters riot, with dog whistles everywhere from BlackLivesMatters to the rapidly emerging Purple Revolution. The ‘philanthropists’ Eric Schmidt, Mark Zuckerberg, George Soros, the Rothschild family. Everyone involved in US foreign policy, Jen Psaki for one, spending US debt on weakening military power and prestige and drawing the US into unwinnable wars that benefit foreign powers like Israel and Saudi Arabia. The paedophiles at the heart of Clinton’s campaign team, e.g. John Podesta. Their religious persuasion is irrelevant to me but their actions, soiling the social contract and undermining age-old moral and legal institutions and authorities to me are not, and indicate alignment with Marxism, aka anti-Christian, aka Satanism.
        Your mileage may vary.

  8. GunnamattaMEMBER

    Some charts for the weekend

    The demographic composition of the new Congress (Bloomberg)

    Voter turnout in the US over time (Quartz)

    Updated US Presidential election swing map. Size of the bubbles is raw votes swung. Color is direction.

    US inflation expectations this week (I think Trumpie will be opening the purse strings. A nation rioting days after he is elected will go feral if the economy goes observably South)

    Global Bond markets turning into a market enema (at the thought of Trump? US Fed raising rates? global disenchantment with the 1% crowd?)

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Well, with all the Trump “excitement” going on of late , I hadn’t really noticed the much reduced vitriol leveled a Boomers over the past week.
      But I do notice on your first chart, the majority of Trumps congress are Boomers!

      At least if it all goes pear shaped, we have got a whole Generation to blame.
      The System, pffft!,….Boomers did it!
      Everybody knows Correlation and causation are the same thing!

      • Aren’t you the one who wants to work within the system, trying to reanimate a 100 year old cadaver called ALP like some proletarian Dr Frankenstein?

        The boomers? Pffffft we have rusted ons we can chase

      • Ref – preznit race outcome and latent soul surcharging….

        Exhale… wellie… I seem to remember a time in the hellcon [oops halcyon] days [thought (believed) I was doing something important(?)] in the military… anywho… must have been a bad month or something [too many 2:00AM alpha alerts total packup and unpack show lasting 18hrs-ish]. So hard ass attitude was SOP all around thingy….

        With this in mind on one glorious mornings PT on the DMZ someone had a serious malfunction and had the audacity to voice a negative emotional state of mind. Good Grief… the damage that could cause to morale could un-stabilize the entire 38th parallel demanded swift and immediate action [!!!!] to thwart an obvious communistic insurrection.

        Luck would have it that our sage PT instructor in – charge – had the perfict solution…. wait for it… wait… put the grumbling ungrateful socialists in charge for one exercise each and let them feel the power of authority – for a brief moment.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. and how does everyone think that went…… eh….

        PS. miggie…. I can only imagine you in such a scenario… REMF’s gone wild or Chairborne or nothing…. chortle…

      • With Millenials and Gen X aged voters outnumbering the others, if the Congress is like this, you’d want to look at voting participation by those groups. Oh, I see.

        Much better not to participate. Then if it doesn’t go right, they can always blame boomers.

        Stardew Valley is much more interesting than real life anyhow.

      • This is one of the best things I have seen written – Doug Casey. Quite honestly brilliant…



        A brief word on US political parties. I’ve said for years that the Demopublicans and the Republicrats are just two wings of the same party. One says it’s for social freedom (which is a lie), but is actively antagonistic to economic freedom. The other says it’s for economic freedom (which is a lie), but is actively antagonistic to social freedom. Both are controlled by members of the Deep State.

        I still think that’s an accurate description of reality. But, in truth, it’s a little unfair to the Republicans. The creatures who control the Republican Party are one thing—and they were massively repudiated by the victory of Trump. Good riddance. But the people who gravitate towards the GOP are something else. To them, the GOP mostly represents a cultural club they belong to.

        Rank and file Republicans don’t have any cohesive philosophy binding them together. They’re just sympathetic to “traditional” values. They like the picture postcard version of America. The 1950’s style “Father Knows Best” family. The world of “American Graffiti”. A house in the suburbs, or a small, neat farm. Thanksgiving dinners with relatives. The exchange of Christmas cards. Going to church on Sunday. The husband having a job that allows him to support the wife and kids. Chevrolets and Fords. A relatively small, non-predatory government. A friendly neighborhood cop. A basically decent and stable society, which doesn’t tolerate crime, or overly outlandish behavior, where social norms are understood and observed.

        You get the picture. It’s a cultural thing, not an ideological or political construct. Unfortunately, it’s no longer a reality. It’s more and more just an ideal, about as dated as a Norman Rockwell painting on the defunct Saturday Evening Post.

        The Democrats are quite different in outlook. They see themselves as hip and sophisticated, and see traditional values as “square”. They’re for globalism, not American nationalism. Forget the clean cut Mouseketeers; the fat and loathsome Lena Dunham is the new role model. Political correctness rules. White men are automatically despised. Black is beautiful. Women are better than men. The very idea of America is in disrepute, and held in contempt. Multiculturalism overrules home-grown values. Etc. Etc.

        You’ll notice that there was very little discussion about policy in this election. It was almost all ad hominem attacks, mostly pushing emotional hot buttons, not intellectual points. It’s all about a culture clash. It’s a non-violent civil war. These two groups no longer have very much in common. And they don’t just disagree, they hate each other.

        Is a real civil war possible? Unlikely. The electorate is too degraded to actually get off their couches to fight, apart from the fact few know how to use a gun any more. Besides, 25% of the US is on antidepressants or other psychoactive drugs; they’re too passive to want radical change. Almost half the country is on some form of the dole; they fear having their doggy dishes taken away. More than half the country is obese; fat people tend to avoid street fights. The median age in the US is 38; old people don’t usually get in fights. Anyway, everybody lives on their electronic devices, not the real world.

        You’ll notice that voting for Trump and Hillary broke along cultural lines. The Republicans won the rural areas (which are dropping in population); the Democrats won the cities (which are growing). The Reps are white (and becoming no more than a plurality); the Dems have most of the so-called “people of color”, who used to be called “colored people” (and are becoming a majority). The Reps did better with males; the Dems better with females, who tend to see the world in softer and gentler shades. The Reps are favored by native-born Americans; the Dems are favored by immigrants, who often have very different values. The Reps represent the diminishing middle-class; the Dems represent the growing underclass. The Reps did better with older people, who are on their way out; the Dems did better with younger people, indoctrinated by academia and the media, who are on their way up.

        None of this looks good for the future of traditional American culture. In fact, Hillary won the popular vote. That means, demographics being what they are, the Republicans are in more trouble next time. With current immigration and birth patterns, the constituency of the Democrats should gain about 2% every four-year election cycle in the future. Even more important, as we leave the eye of the storm that started in 2007, and go into the trailing edge of the economic hurricane, the Trump administration will be blamed. There will, therefore, be a radical reaction away from what it’s believed to represent in 2020.

        It used to be the Reps and the Dems differentiated mostly on ideological grounds. Now it’s much more on cultural grounds. Allow me to identify the elephant in the room, and spell out the real nature of the Democratic Party.

        The Democratic party is a cesspool filled with leftist social engineers, academics, busy-body pundits, the “elite”, cultural Marxists, race baiters, racial “minorities” who see race as their main identity, radical feminists and LBGT types, entitled underachievers, statists, the soft-headed, the envy-driven, the stupid, professional losers, haters of free markets, and people who simply hate the idea of America. I can’t imagine anyone of good will, or even common decency, being a member of today’s Democratic Party. It needs to be flushed. But it will only get stronger in the near future, for many reasons.

        But it’s an honest party—they generally say what they believe, even if it’s repulsive to anyone who values things like liberty. Interestingly, there are no Dinos—unless they’re Stalinists or Maoists who think the others aren’t going far enough. The party has absolutely no redeeming values.

        A real battle for the soul of the country is shaping up. But I fear it won’t be heroic, so much as sordid. The knaves versus the fools. The Dems are the evil party, but the Reps are just the stupid party.

        Why? Trump and the Trumpers have no ideology except a vision of a vanished world. They’re understandably angry, but don’t know what to do about it. They have no real program, except to say the Dems have gone too far. No coherent philosophy, just a nebulous belief that the Democrats are wrong. They’re justifiably fed up with the Establishment that gave them non-entities like Dole, McCain, and Romney.

        Why did Trump win? Two reasons.

        First, “Cultural Americans” know that their culture is dying, and their standard of living is declining. They sensed—correctly—that this would be their “last hurrah”, their last real kick at the cat. Trump is likely the last white male President. Unless a rabid statist like Tim Kaine is elected in 2020, with promises of a new and more radical New Deal. Or ongoing wars tilt the odds towards a general, most of whom are still white males.

        Second, don’t forget that Trump wasn’t the only protest candidate in the primaries. There was Bernie. His supporters know that Hillary and the Dem insiders stole it from him, and they’re still very unhappy. Many abstained from voting for Hillary because of the theft. A few probably voted for Trump out of spite. Or because they wanted to burn the house down. Nobody says this.

        Perversely, they’ll get their wish. The Greater Depression will deepen under Trump, even if he makes the right moves. Which will play into the election of someone from the Democrat cesspool in 2020. So maybe the Trump victory isn’t such a good thing after all.

        But let’s look at the bright side. All things considered, we’re in for some wonderful free (kind of) entertainment.

      • RT….. you’re better than an anarcho-capitalist gold bug spewing deep state Alex Jones type of tinfoil click bait or so I thought…

        Disheveled Marsupial…. just to refresh your memory… just prior to the GFC the whole Ranoid – Free Market posse was fist pumping and ringing in the glorious new utopian future…. then it went up like the reactors at Fukushima… then the blame game and scapegoating became an abstract performance art… instead of some much needed self introspection…

  9. I’m very pleased to see Donald has a correct and accurate opinion of the Fed’s decisions. That’s where his entire focus & influence to “make america great again” is desperately needed. Anything (anything!!) he can do to influence / force giving the currency real value and pricing debt accordingly is welcome.

    • The only thing that gives fiat value is taxation…. because….. its not a commodity or can be privately owned…. derrrrrr

      Disheveled Marsupial…. FYI your part of the problem Andy…. ideologues demanding something be – something it is not – for quasi religious reasons only…. akin to young earth sorts….

      • Ultimately, the currency is backed by the force the government can bring on you. Taxation just symbolize that force in a less threatening manner.

      • Miggie….

        Laws govern social groups…. see our species entire history from hunter gather on wards, anthro is very clear here. Even then capital crimes were punishable by banishment or death, hell you were not even considered a full fledged member of a group until a certain age and passing some ritual and being accepted – into – the group.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. vacuous metaphysics aside….

      • “Even then capital crimes were punishable by banishment or death” so actual force was used not bits of paper? Q. E. D…

      • Skippy – wow, must you exhalt this Sapolsky level of dissonance, ad nauseum? If I needed to hear condescending trotskyite babble, I could head down to the nearest lecture hall. Why must you jump down Andy’s throat for a slight incoherence in argument? I’m pretty sure he was referring to asset values in a roundabout way. It comes off a little dilettante and subhuman, brother.

      • Sorry miggie I can’t phantom your meaning… the “paper” you note is just the physical representation of a contract [law], this state of affairs has existed in humanity even before writing came along. Yet everyone is allowed to trade and settle in whatever they wish, its just taxes have to be payed in inexpensive fiat, if you don’t like the state of affairs over the last 50ish years, why not deal with the core issues of neoliberalism and stop the fixation on its individual out put and endless tail chasing….

        Disheveled Marsupial…. its akin to the old religious dilemma…. if bad things happen to non believers its punishment… and when it happens to believers its a test of faith….

        PS. always liked the parable about the religious man pleading to his spiritual advisor about becoming destitute and in need of divine guidance to rectify this calamity….. only to be told by his spiritual advisor that’s not his job or purpose… his task is guiding his soul… preparing his soul for passage into heaven… priorities FFS lmmao….

      • dystopeon….

        I don’t do ims or ologys…. what I do is reference more concise reference points to humanities past and how that reflects on our present and possible future.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. Don’t waste your time trying to pigeonholing me to suit your biases, I know I screw around alot, but there is a point that when others try to arbitrarily ascribe qualities about myself [projections], that entice me to lean quite hard on such sloppy rhetorical sophistry….

      • The Traveling Wilbur

        You and I, and TOED, must have different definitions of “concise” there Skip. But thanks for making my morning. 🙂

  10. “Night of the Pigs” – nice painting to cover the discussion. And speaking of Nights, for those that follow lunar antics to fathom the markets…
    Monday November 14th 2016. Supermoon Forecast: The Moon Hasn’t Been This Close in Almost 69 Years

    • If it’s that close maybe we can John Kerry to learn about climate change or whatever. Is he in NZ now? Spends election day in Antarctica – was he afraid of Hillary losing or winning?

  11. http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/revealed-14-car-deaths-in-pointtopoint-speed-camera-zones-in-nsw-20161110-gsn05i.html
    Am I the only one that absolute hates these @#$%ing speed cameras?
    I haven’t had an accident in over 40 years of driving yet when I’m in Australia I get speeding tickets, thing is I’m not “speeding” in any sense of the word as it would apply in any other country. Take Dallas on i635 the official speed limit is 55mph but practically nobody drives slower than 70mph. I couldn’t imaging getting a speeding ticket for any thing under 80mph. Compare this to Sydney where I get tickets for driving at 5kmph over the speed limit and there’s not even a cop to argue with it’s a damn speed camera. These days when driving in Sydney I’m more focused on the speedometer than the road, is that honestly where you want drivers to be focusing?
    As if the current situation wasn’t bad enough we have these clowns (link) suggesting that existing point-to-point speed systems need to activated for cars as well as trucks, WHY? I can only guess that these point-to-point systems are run by private operators like Serco, making this whole thing nothing more than a cynical revenue grab by a foreign company. Is that what Sydneysiders want?

    • No, I suspect most of us in Sysdney don’t want more of the speed cameras and point to point cameras but it doesn’t matter which of Tweedledee and Tweedledum is in power. More rules, more regulations and more revenue in the form of fines.
      All in the name of public safety, of course.

      • As they balloon populations and provide zero infrastructure – the corruption of our governments is deep!

      • but it doesn’t matter which of Tweedledee and Tweedledum is in power. More rules, more regulations and more revenue in the form of fines
        But why? is this some form of Puritanism, like Skippy said If I wasn’t breaking the rules ……
        Thing is I can go 5 years without getting a speeding ticket in the US yet I’m lucky if I can go 5 weeks in Australia. In Australia I’m driving slower and IMHO less safely because my focus is on that damn speedo rather than being focused on the road and what other drivers are doing, don’t get me started on School zones …Next time you’re at a Sydney school zone stop for 10 min and look at the other drivers, see what they’re focused on, it ain’t the road and it’s definitely not the kids.

      • In Victoria, you can now get fined going 1km over, with a 2km buffer – in other words, you can get fined for going 3km over the limit. At the same time, there are not enough police to deal with the huge increase in carjackings, car thefts and home burglaries by disaffected youths. And if even if the police do catch these young crims, they nearly always get off scot free in the courts. I know I am talking apples and oranges, but you have a much greater chance of copping a fine just by speeding than thieving, and all because you took your eyes off the odometer for a few seconds to look at the road.

      • The Pedestrian Council of Australia hates cars. My friend who works at the RTA mentions how they will lobby politicians for more speed cameras, lower speed limits, and other road rules that inconvenient drivers. In contrast, there is no motoring association in Australia that hates pedestrians.

        To give you an idea..


      • In Victoria, you can now get fined going 1km over, with a 2km buffer – in other words, you can get fined for going 3km over the limit.

        Good ol’d Victoria. The speed enforcement capital of the world, yet not even close to the world’s safest roads.

        Surely people must challenge these 3km/h over tickets ? The speedo in your car isn’t required to be that accurate (though most of them are calibrated to read high, so you’d probably struggle).

    • What part of looking at and maintaining a speed on a public conveyance escapes you China_bob…. I mean if you did not break the law there would be no infringement fee… sounds self inflicted…

      Disheveled Marsupial… mate what you need is to move to the ME where freedom abounds… see on the lonely stretches of mans control driving a deadly weapon the game of chicken reigns supreme… something about boredom and Dwags will thingy…

      • I almost bought a nice car in Syd last week, until we were half way through the test drive and l noticed a Datsun 120y was keeping up with me. we were both doing around 20 ks p/h?

      • Hear you 8mill….

        Thing is safety… having a wife that has yonks as a ambo and a clinical educator in paramedical science is the main determinate in buying a means of transportation.

        But hay…. in my misspent youth in the bible belt we would lose about 10+ teens every spring, something about the tax on freedom winter brought and springs revolution…. having huge V8s coupled with early automotive suspension and steering geometry sold to the public as a positive super ego thingy seems to have a down side…..

        Disheveled Marsupial…. seems the bushies are reexamining this dynamic wrt the high powered 4X4 ATVs…. to many dead or maimed family members will do that to ya….

      • Safety my arse you lunatic, any typical ambo client is a boomer with shortness of breath – there are millions of people on the road everyday in Victoria and there were 250 death last year. As they pump population! Your mind control doesn’t work any more.

      • Miggie your so wrong its not even funny guy, but not to worry the monitization of education means profit before skill and there does seem an uptick in narcissistic tendencies and egotistical excess. Hope that does not effect you too much in a time of need.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. anywho it might end up with income increases for ambos as a carrot to privatize this social good, so it can stop being a drain on the budget and increase productivity and as such GDP… that might result in lower taxes and user payes…. unless the consultants and shareholders ™ see it otherwise…. good luck with that….

      • I’m what?

        2015 toll 2016 toll
        221 248 (up 12.2%)

        2014-2015 claims involving >14 days hospitalisation 2015-2016 claims involving >14 days hospitalisation
        896 922 (up 2.9%)

        Out of 3 million DAILY road users, so basically out of a possible BILLION events.

        It’s you who’s in lalaland!

      • Miggie….

        I was responding to “any typical ambo client is a boomer with shortness of breath”

        As far as traffic related injury’s and mortality you seem to forget property damage and resulting insurance costs as well as the inconvenience to others or the loss of income some might suffer….

        Again were back to a watery term that is not well defined but held up as sacrosanct…. unless one is on the receiving end of a bad outcome e.g. one persons positive freedom overreaching on another in a negative manner. Strange thing is people that carry on excessively about this can’t seem to reconcile the part about those at the top exercising their freedoms afforded by wealth and power and end up granting it validity by furiously trying to get their own or applying the same methods on those below their status…

        As I’ve said before… Libertarianism is basically the poor unwashed mans Corporatism, where by getting the mopes to imitate or sing the same song it gives the elitists vindication…. the early RCC should exemplify this process imo.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. this is all made more curious by the original archetypes of your preferred philosophical school having a spat about a bad apple in the genealogical deal miss-allocating capital so it was the lake for him, but, in the end became exactly what they despised….

        PS. Once had a very wealth mate say he could afford a drink driving infringement, that was his mentality, ended up getting on down the road [pun intended], lmmao his tune changed with the loss of his freedom, completely self inflicted….. but stomped his pretty little shoes anyway….

    • I’ll tip you one –

      Brisbane City Council take the prize.
      I met a mate recently for dinner on a stopover.
      He’s a tradie without much work and I felt bad about taking his petrol money and not a cab, yet a wanted to drop me in near central so I could get onto the airport train out.
      The traffic was gridded and banked up behind red lights and we were on the left hand lane about 5 metres from the traffic light. I jumped out – pretty much out of the passenger car door and onto the sidewalk next to the zebra crossing and go take the train.
      2 weeks later he is issued with a 420 dollar fine for stopping in a no standing zone.

      Seems unAustralian.

      I didn’t let this test our mateship and offered to pay right out – the infringment being similar to my return airticket from whereever it was I came. We held out.. let it go to court.. haven’t heard anything… yet it’s not the country I grew up in.

      • Your mate should have contested it and asked for the photo if it truly happened that quickly. Likely it was just a bloke nearby in a BCC car stuck in the same traffic who saw you jump out and grabbed the license plate number. Without a photo they can’t pursue.

      • They now have roaming vehicles which automatically ticket parking and related traffic violations. The Job site I’m on now in the west end next to the river has netted heaps of tradies illegally parking on yellow lines and such. Luckily on our site you can use the underground parking most of the time, otherwise its at least a 3 block walk.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. Sillycon valley technology is always progress right – ???????

      • So you’re telling me that it’s illegal for a Passenger to get out of a car that’s stopped at a Red light when the car is in the lane next to the footpath?
        WHY, who made these F’ed up laws? Is it all just a shameless revenue grab? No wonder I can’t even have a short vacation in Australia without falling foul of at least one of your F’edup laws. All done in the name of Safety naturally!
        It really pisses me off but you know what’s strange is that Aussies will tell you how much they value their Freedom and would therefore never live in China, I just laugh because China doesn’t have any of these F’ed-up laws.

      • Miggie and China-Bob…

        If people have difficulty in operating a vehicle on a public conveyance I would suggest they never operate heavy machinery or explosives, cavalier attitudes and grousing on about watery terms like freedoms ™ [whole nexus of possessive vs negative outcomes] have a bad habit of eventually doing in themselves or others and sometimes both….

        Now the bit about revenue is interesting but again is complicated by taxation and stuff that went boom in the GFC along with public private partnerships not performing as envisioned….

        Disheveled Marsupial…. lol running a state or smaller like a business and then having a dummy spat is classic own goal….

      • Hi haroldus and all
        thanks for your responses – to be honest we never found out how the event came to notice. most likely it was CCTV.
        we called them on it – basically by letting the incident go thru the full process and asking them to provide the evidence.
        never heard anything back from them.

        I can also tell you that I was down in Melbourne recently and borrowed my dad’s car.
        I was parked in Docklands with a valid ticket correctly displayed in the window. I was issued a 330 dollar ticket nonetheless.
        I contested with the evidence, yet it was rejected. So, my 10 dollar or so I paid for parking really failed as a decision.

        I also took another 300 dollar fine two days later on the city of Yarra in Melbourne in the same car for being parked in a clearway. I had an emergency phone call as my mum is a paraplegic and I was down there helping out and had to stop. I pulled up and bought a ticket from the machine that I’d slotted into. Unfortunately for me CCTV camera showed that I was in a clearway zone for that 15 minutes I was pulled up. I argued that by having a machine open and active that they had incorrectly signposted the area, however to no avail.

        Ended up paying these two. However, I can say that this whole pie has bad karma.
        I stick to my bicycle these days. In Darwin city parking is free and a parking fine is 40 dollars even if I did take my car.
        Then you have idiots from Victoria come up here and try and pressure council people up here to take up the Victorian way of gauging on parking in the city. The bad karma of a million impotent bulls to these people.

        At the back of my mind was the guy with the flipped ticket who ended up owing some obscene amount.

      • So you’re telling me that it’s illegal for a Passenger to get out of a car that’s stopped at a Red light when the car is in the lane next to the footpath?

        One reason these laws exist is because of cyclists. It’s not very nice riding up beside a car when somebody decides to open a door in your face, especially if you get the corner of it.

      • Because cyclists don’t have eyeballs? Never had this problem ever nor anyone Ive ever met. Fines on the other hand? Even on a bicycle. Leftie supplicant

      • Issue is Dr Smithy, that I alighted from the left side of the car, it’s illegal for cyclists to pass on the left of a car that is in the gutter.
        Can understand that fundraising targets are essential to paying back council debt. Can assure you that the extra 600 dollars was not reallocated from smashed avocado and lattes, yet was taken on notice as a lesson.

        However I won’t be going back to those places. Whether the shopkeepers win or not is not really a council priority.

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        Im lucky enough to be able to reject clients in the built up, dificult parking areas of Sydney.
        When I book a job I immediately look up the address on Google maps, and if the parking looks shit, I call the client back and just say an emergency has come up and I wont be able to get to their job this week.

        IF they press me to still do their plumbing job at later date, because they think im so Charming, well I then have to tell em the truth.
        No easy Parking, I no do the job.

        Its one of the three primary reasons I decided to work for myself, for the rest of my working life, aftwr returning from Cloudbreak.
        The other 2, being the ability to knock back any job (no real-estates or facilities management gigs) and an inability to any longer act civilly and respectfully towards usless, beurocratic safety advisors (Im never wearing hi vis again,…[email protected] pricks telling us what to wear FFS!)

      • Because cyclists don’t have eyeballs?

        Because when a door opens a foot in front of you, you’re fucked, even if your day job is “ninja assassin”.

        Never had this problem ever nor anyone Ive ever met.

        Well then, I guess like everything else you haven’t personally experienced, it must be impossible !

        Back in the real world, people can end up needing reconstructive surgery, lose teeth, lose eyes, and occasionally get killed.

        There are even some particularly evil individuals who deliberately try to door cyclists.

        Leftie supplicant

        You clever boy, you’ve learnt a new word ! I’d suggest you don’t overuse it, but, we all know that’d be a waste of time.

      • Issue is Dr Smithy, that I alighted from the left side of the car, it’s illegal for cyclists to pass on the left of a car that is in the gutter.

        Bicycles are explicitly allowed to pass vehicles on the left.

      • Those are the arsehole cyclists who think they own the side strip and shout a pedestrians and cars all day. I’ve given a few of them knee problems myself by kicking out the back wheel when they shout at me – so I know it happens and I know they deserve it! Especially here in Melbourne, cyclists with the full gay wear on are Inveraribly fuckwits.

    • Wow, you actually got to go 5 k’s OVER the speed limit in Sydney? Luck bastard, it get all happy when I reach the speed limit!

  12. fuckin clarke telling australians how to bat. remember your last england tour michael?

    gimme KP any day.

    • Good article. Key point, I think:

      “If a voter is racist, you don’t have to be OK with it. The left must stand against racism. But it must also stand against turning away from people who are suffering, on the basis that they do not meet our own moral standards, which are rarely as high we imagine them to be anyway.”


      • No, point missed. More white women voted for Trump than Clinton, and the non-white vote also increased from the previous election. A clear indication that no matter how much women and minority groups despised Trump’s racism and sexism, they were more concerned about wealth inequality.

      • Critical Theory is embedded in what is still anachronistically being called the ‘left’. The left doesn’t exist – its fig leaf nomenclature for race and gender radicals. The bile and hate may be diminished in this article, but the usual presumptions that underpin all the arguments are intact. The drunks (ideologues) are a bit worn out and sleepy, but they are committed alcoholics and will be back to their old ways at the slightest chance. Not to be trusted.

      • FiftiesFibroShack


        What percentage of people that traditionally vote Democrat do imagine are “race and gender radicals”?

        What are “the usual presumptions that underpin all the arguments” as you see them?

      • @Fifties
        a. I’m not Roy Morgan. But the gender and race radicals will not be voting Republican.
        b. These purportedly rational, ‘where did we go wrong’ pieces must maintain the narrative that Trump voters are at core, synonymous with racism and misogyny et al. Every single one I have read holds this central tenet, regardless of any other analysis showing the failings of the left. This is a fundamental misreading of the social mood behind the Trump presidency. Willful blindness of the ideologue or politically disingenuous? At no point does the Medium piece we are referring to accept that Trump voters are NOT racist or sexist – its just a matter of degree to this author. Tell that to the Hispanics and women who voted for him.

      • While “at home”, no doubt someone lacking common sense, maturity and perspective. Someone who sees the world predominantly through a prism of race or gender with a tendency to view their preferred gender or race as almost always and everywhere hard done by and fairly impervious to any evidence to the contrary.
        A liberal dollop of avoiding any modicum of responsibility and attributing adverse outcomes to outside forces also helps with identification.

      • While “at home”, no doubt someone lacking common sense, maturity and perspective. Someone who sees the world predominantly through a prism of race or gender with a tendency to view their preferred gender or race as almost always and everywhere hard done by and fairly impervious to any evidence to the contrary.
        A liberal dollop of avoiding any modicum of responsibility and attributing adverse outcomes to outside forces also helps with identification.

        Sounds like a typical redpiller.

      • While “at home”, no doubt someone lacking common sense, maturity and perspective. Someone who sees the world predominantly through a prism of race or gender with a tendency to view their preferred gender or race as almost always and everywhere hard done by and fairly impervious to any evidence to the contrary.

        You mean like you guys on here constantly bleeting about how the white man is under threat from strong womens, or transgenders?

      • “under threat from strong womens, or transgenders?”

        Because transgenders aren’t white men? Your discrimination knows no bounds…

    • “the left may never again win a majority of the white working class vote”

      That one sentence demonstrates how detached from reality the “left” have become. The policies of the centre-left parties (Democrats US, and Labor in AUS) have always been favourable to their traditional working class voter base. It is a change in policy which has cost them the working class vote. The problem is then compounded by turning on the working class and calling them racist and “deplorable” for supporting the only parties prepared to listen to their concerns on immigration and globalisation.

      I tried to find Labor’s immigration policies but could only find references to Asylum-seekers which is probably a good summation of the Labor’s current immigration policy. i.e. they have been baited by LNP on asylum-seekers and have turned a blind eye to broader immigration policy.

      An extract from the Greens immigration policy below. These clowns have taken the extra step of ignoring their own policy and denouncing the parties which are offering to implement them.
      “Skilled migration programs that do not substitute for training or undermine wages and conditions in Australia.”

  13. Leonard Cohen and the lovely Dobell painting. Now if I can just justify wasting my weekend reading the articles instead of sipping soy flat whites at hipster cafes in my birks.

    • I’ve decided to boycott my local 3065 hipster cafe after they put a sign on their tip jar:
      “Bring Back Lee Harvey Oswald Fund #Trump2016”
      I was willing to overlook the desecrated Bible they display but calling for murder is unfunny and beyond the pale.

      • ‘Bring Back Lee Harvey Oswald’ would imply historical knowledge. Instead, they probably think they’re crowdfunding a new album from Nick Cave’s old girlfriend.

      • @ajostu – politically correct =/= morally correct.
        Your response is a great example of moral relativism, which has no limits or compass.

    • I agree Catherine. That Dobell painting is superb. The depiction of the diffraction halo around the moon is something else.
      Thanks for sharing Gunnamatta.

      • No doubt Gunnamatta had this Monday’s super super moon in mind.
        No I don’t support murder humour at all either. Perhaps you can enjoy the nice quiet non-hip cafe of your neighbourhood.

      • Actually guys the choice of this weeks Australian painting icon reflected the fact I had discovered the passing of Leonard Cohen a few minutes previously and when looking through the AGNSW site I spotted what I knew to be one of (if not the) last painting Dobell ever finished, and wondered (as I do on occasions when contemplative) if those dying know something which will have a lasting refrain. Because as I found myself looking at Dobells work (a masterpiece, with the refraction of the moon giving the work – as you point out – an ethereal eternality redolent of the experience of anyone who has grown up in the country and seen such moons across fields fairly frequently) I wondered what he (in the frame of mind as his life was coming to close) would have made of a man carried to the pinnacle of power by protest.

        Those trussed carcasses – do they embody hope or aspiration? Are they oligarchs held to account some moonlit night as truth zeros in from afar? Or are they us, pigs of the proletariat being sacrificed again to send a lesson to the bounteous field (made abstract with anger?) or to provide it with a spectacle long enough to tire? Where are we in time? (and how would the game plan change if we knew?) Is that light of the east making the vision just before dawn? Or is it the west leaving a whole night to be weathered? Does anybody looking out on the scene think of the dawn of the new day? Or does time stand still on the night of the pigs……..

        ….and then the thought occurred that I hadn’t done a Dobell previously (and that I needed to hurry).

      • Thank you Gunnamatta

        I am in an office of IT hacks in San Bernardino Cal. When you load up these links it is Friday afternoon our time.

        We really like the Australian art. I would say I have learned more about Australian art from Macrobusiness weekend links than anywhere else (but Australian art is pretty obscure for us). But its cool and we like it. Thanks.

  14. http://www.realestate.com.au/property-house-nsw-middleton+grange-123644466

    Afternoon folks. Went to the auction and about 20 people with only one registered bidder. We got kicked out so the party can negotiate with the seller..
    So no bids.
    Forgot to add – originally was listed at $1.15m negotiable. Spoek to the agent now and was told anything between $1m and $1.1m so $50k discount. I think it will sell below $900k. I am not saying it is worth that much.

    • I remember we discussed this last week! or the week before or something

      please keep us posted re: the final result

      what a travesty that it is selling for anywhere close to 900k

      • The top must be near as few days ago my wife cousin was given $580k loan to buy a villa in Bankstown – he is truck driver picking rubbish from building sites and his son is a Team Leader at Bunnings. Now I am very sure about 20% of the wages of the driver are cash so his payslips would not be very high and even with the cash I doubt he makes more than $80k. The TL at Bunnings would not be more than $60k (I might be wrong). Guess Which Bank? lol
        They had $64k deposit.

      • Nikola, that doesn’t even seem that extreme compared with what I’ve seen in the past. The loan is only around 4-5 x gross income. Combined income of around $140k gross, P&I repayments would only be around $33,000 a year.

      • $1m for the privilege of living 50 kms away from the CBD. This world is insane.

        What we really need is the major parties to ignore what happened in the US. Keep on cramming in 300k immigrants every year and calling anyone who complains a racist. That’ll fix it.

      • It’ll be an ideal adobe for insomniac plane enthusiasts as it’s less than 5km away from Sydney’s new 24 hours second airport!!

        On a more serious note, 4 bdr house around the area are selling for below 800K, so anyone willing to pay 1mil + is definitely a sucker.

    • I’m interest in result too.

      Be interesting also to see if Trump has any effect on Sydney clearance rates.

      • Agent said he will call me later in the week if I am still interested and if does I will ask him. Otherwise we will have to wait and see if they list the price online – when/if it sells.

    • Something really Interesting I noticed about the generals, neither candidate mentioned God much, islam was mentioned but no Christian crap. Trump won as a Republican without Bible bashing and everyone still calls him establishment. I dont buy it

      • I’ve got no idea what’s going to happen. Trump appears to be a self interested bullshitter to me. It was easy to question Clinton’s direction because she was a known quantity. Trump isn’t, politically anyway. Will he be hands on, or will he appoint people and just let them do it? Can he see past his own business interests and experiences when trying to come up with policies? Will he listen to people who he doesn’t agree with? Can he take criticism when it is valid? Can he supress his ego when required? It is just a case of wait and see.

      • Trump will have his own comfortable ‘establishment’ before long.

        Trump is clearly not a religious man, that’s why he chose Pence for running mate, to do the bible bashing for him.

      • Except it was Trump who had tens of thousands coming to see him, not Pence who was barely visible – so whatever Jason, keep your head in the sand because reality is too hard for you to deal with.

    • Some Mea Culpa:
      ‘”When [Trump] talks, I actually understand what he’s saying,” a young Pennsylvanian named Trent Gower told me at a Trump event a month ago. “But, like, when fricking Hillary Clinton talks, it just sounds like a bunch of bullshit.”
      “So these Trump voters had a comprehension problem.” says Taibbi.

      Reframing the narrative 2.0 – only white dummies with limited comprehension voted for Trump and we couldn’t see how stupid they were; sorry for that.

      • I think you missed the point of the piece.
        It might have been an ugly way to make his point, but that encounter was used to highlight the distance between that man and the elites in their cordoned off section of America.
        Taibbi blamed the press (including himself) for not listening to Americans, or talking to them instead of at them and over them. He used that one encounter as an example, not of what that person was supposedly lacking, but the failure of the press and Democratic party to show any real interest in him. If they actually cared about him they would have made the effort to reach him.

      • The left have nothing left but virtue signalling. They have steadfastly failed to deliver anything in 30 years except repeal of don’t ask, don’t tell and other LGBTQZFUWK shire. The “alt right” are actually delivering, and psychology says that’s what people are drawn to… There is no Republican party, Trump killed it! No more southern strategy, no more Bible bashing, no more war…

      • Miggie….

        The left were monetized in the 70s and became an arts movement, neoliberalism became the dominate socioeconomic and political reality for everyone, with pandering to bases a form of brand manipulation.

        As far as the alt right goes I’ll wait and – see – if it unshackles neoliberalism or just ends up being a new populist facade of it.

        Trump and the Alt-Right

        “Trump’s appeal to his base has two main components: the promise of a return to prosperity and an “America First” identity politics. But one seems to have outweighed the other. “If it were just an economic issue, there would be blacks and Latinos lining up behind Trump,” says Nell Irvin Painter, a historian at Princeton University. In reality, the line between “America First” and “whites first” is hopelessly blurred.

        Which is of course, where the alt-right gets excited. “Donald Trump is certainly not a member of the alt-right,” says Jared Taylor, a prominent alt-right leader and head of the white supremacist New Century Foundation. “But he seems to have instinctively, clumsily stumbled upon some of the policies that we’ve been promoting for a long time.” To alt-right leaders, Donald Trump is less messiah than a convenient, half-enlightened monkey wrench thrown into the political machine.

        But they see in his anti-immigrant and isolationist policies a future for their interests. “It’s impossible to know how many people voted for Trump based on feelings of racial dispossession. But a Trump presidency reopens a closed book,” Taylor says. “It’s not inconceivable that Donald Trump and people around him will start publicly discussing racial differences in IQ. Or that maybe some people don’t belong here, which clearly leads to racial analysis. No Hillary appointee would ever say that. To them, it would be evil.” Reminder: this man is arguing that these are good reasons for having Donald Trump in power.”


        Unfortunately it seems many have completely miss understood what neoliberalism – is – and as such completely misconstrue events past, present and potential future. I will attempt to clarify this yet once again:

        Neoliberals are not fundamentalists. But they approach crises with a certain logic–one that is directly relevant to comprehending neoliberalism’s unexpected strength in the current global crisis.


        Throughout the second half of the twentieth century, the neoliberal project stood out from other strains of right-wing thought in that it was self-consciously constituted as an entity dedicated to the development, promulgation, and popularization of doctrines intended to mutate over time. It was a moveable feast, and not a catechism fixed at the Council of Trent. It is very important to have some familiarity with neoliberal ideas, if only to resist simple-minded characterizations of the neoliberal approach to the financial crisis as some form of evangelical “market fundamentalism.”

        Although many secondhand purveyors of ideas on the right might wish to crow that “market freedom” promotes their own brand of religious righteousness, or maybe even the converse, it nonetheless debases comprehension to conflate the two by disparaging both as “fundamentalism”—a sneer unfortunately becoming commonplace on the left. It seems very neat and tidy to assert that neoliberals operate in a modus operandi on a par with religious fundamentalists: just slam The Road to Serfdom (or if you are really Low-to-No Church, Atlas Shrugged) on the table along with the King James Bible, and then profess to have unmediated personal access to the original true meaning of the only (two) book(s) you’ll ever need to read in your lifetime. Counterpoising morally confused evangelicals with the reality-based community may seem tempting to some; but it dulls serious thought. It may sometimes feel that a certain market-inflected personalized version of Salvation has become more prevalent in Western societies, but that turns out to be very far removed from the actual content of the neoliberal program.

        Neoliberalism does not impart any dose of Old Time Religion. Not only is there no ur-text of neoliberalism; the neoliberals have not themselves opted to retreat into obscurantism, however much it may seem that some of their fellow travelers may have done so. You won’t often catch them wondering, “What Would Hayek Do?” Instead they developed an intricately linked set of overlapping propositions over time — from Ludwig Erhard’s “social market economy” to Herbert Giersch’s cosmopolitan individualism, from Milton Friedman’s “monetarism” to the rational-expectations hypothesis, from Hayek’s “spontaneous order” to James Buchanan’s constitutional order, from Gary Becker’s “human capital” to Steven Levitt’s “freakonomics,” from the Heartland Institute’s climate denialism to the American Enterprise Institute’s geo-engineering project, and, most appositely, from Hayek’s “socialist calculation controversy” to Chicago’s efficient-markets hypothesis. Along the way they have lightly sloughed off many prior classical liberal doctrines — for instance, opposition to corporate monopoly power as politically debilitating, or skepticism over strong intellectual property, or disparaging finance as an intrinsic source of macroeconomic disturbance — without coming clean on their reversals.

        Clearly, neoliberals do not navigate with a fixed static Utopia as the astrolabe for all their political strivings. They could not, since they don’t even agree on such basic terms as “market” and “freedom” in all respects. One can even agree with Robert Brenner and Naomi Klein that crisis is the preferred field of action for neoliberals, since that offers more latitude for introduction of bold experimental “reforms” that only precipitate further crises down the road. Nevertheless, Neoliberalism does not dissolve into a gormless empiricism or random pragmatism. There persists a certain logic to the way it approaches crises; and that is directly relevant to comprehending its unexpected strength in the current global crisis.

        Under that supposition, we endeavor here to provide a necessarily non-canonical characterization of the temporary configuration of doctrines that neoliberals had arrived at by roughly the 1980s. These Thirteen Commandments below are chosen because they have direct bearing upon unfolding developments during the period of the crisis from 2007 onwards.


        Disheveled Marsupial…. miggie… what do you tell someone when they are fundamentally neoliberal and don’t even know it… especially wrt the human state and as an extension of that observation the national state….

      • Agree Mig. The Left is reduced to virtue signalling. It is far removed from the working, lower and even middle classes it despises. The Left now largely comprises university educated professionals (Arts, Humanites, Social Sciences, Journalism and Law). It is an elitist, bossy, authoritarian, petty entity that loves the language of inclusion and fairness to mask its exclusion from the interests of the non elite classes.

      • Thing is skip the candidate with by far and away the most money – lost. That’s a huge problem for neoliberalism, theyre all about money wins…

      • Miggie and Xo…..

        You crazy deluded little buggers…. your both neoliberals….

        This whole thingy is like observing rats trying to mentally chew their way out of a concrete pipe…. on one hand your mental teeth won’t stop growing and on the other hand the concrete is too hard to be penetrated by said teeth… but the OCD like drive in fulfilling the prophecy dictates the path dependency like a drug addict…

        Disheveled Marsupial…. reminiscent of my years of interaction with old beardo over at NC… was once a fundamentalist gold bug austrian and then thought because he changed his views on a commodity standard of soverign money [private standard really] that he was no longer an Austrian. Yet completely agreed with their perspective of not only the human condition but how its “organized” for “optimal” performance….

      • Mig thinks he’s anarchist, and Xo is one of Howard’s ‘Culture Warriors’. That is the prism they see the world through.

      • Jason…

        I think in migs case it was originally anarcho capitalist [AnCap] which might have anarchist tendencies [not that many of them know the originals were more democratic], just can’t see mig in David Graeber’s camp.

        Xo on the other hand is an old cold war solider and patriarchal management team member afflicted by a massive amount of demand pull.

        Disheveled Marsupial…. mig seems flexible and one could make compromises with for a greater good and more reasonable future considering the mounting challenges ahead…. Xo has irrevocably driven stakes into the ground and has a bad habit of pettifoggery to obscure them, which make negotiation next to impossible, poor trust dynamics.

    • Went to a really swanky party last night naturally the topic of the evening was: How to make money with DT in the Whitehouse and Republicans controlling both the house and Congress.
      Number One Strategy: Create perception of a must-have product…Pump up the company, IPO in 2 years, than dump the stock, rinse and repeat.
      I call this the Party like it’s 1999 strategy: damn they were good times, money for nothing. Shit ideas spawning shit products yet producing solid gold startups, solid gold for the founders…as for the pleb investors, they should have know better.
      Trouble is there’s really no emerging product space that’s capturing the publics imagination, sure every Tech startup will somehow make the claim that they’re Robotics and AI specialists but doing WHAT?

      The underlying problem with Robotics is that although there are thousands of possible product ideas the Total Available Market (TAM) for each product is fairly small. I guess we all dream of a self learning Robot that could follow us around the house and teach itself to automate the chores but in reality that’s not going to happen for at least a decade. Trouble is we want to IPO in 2 years so we need a Product that we can at least claim (bold faced lie) is the Robot that’ll do everything you ever wanted done, and last a lifetime (its lifetime not yours). In a way this was the 1990’s market for desktop PC’s, the salesman told you it was the best that money could buy and would last you at least 10 years so you parted with $5K+ dollars and realized two years later that it was almost worthless (Rinse and Repeat)..this PC replacement cycle worked right through till about what 2007/8 before. To create a really valuable Industry Robotics will need to have a similar replacement cycle, if the public can latch onto the Robotics idea than the industry will deliver and we’ll all learn to party again.

      • Remember Isaac Asimov’s short story about a genus with an alcohol problem building a robot in a binge session, things go a bit off the rails after a time, only to find out the genus spent all that time and effort building the most advance robot in history, finding out at the end of it all its true purpose….. to open his beers….

        Disheveled Marsupial…. endless hours spending time to talk about high level philosophical and scientific matters as a sounding board only to end up talking to a bottle opener….. rim shot~~~~

  15. Heather Ridout of the RBA has sold her existing house to a Lin Zhang for 8 million, she should get another AO for being so savvy

  16. Is it time to double down on gold yet? Or is there another leg to go? $1225 is looking like a good entry point…

    • I was considering buying a significant amount of gold for the first time before the US election. It was clear the gold price would have dropped if status quo Clinton won. Trump’s tax cuts for the rich and business reminds me that he is a right-wing conservative. Unless Trump turns out to be the evil prick the paranoid left are trying to convince you he is, then I can only conclude that gold will continue to fall short-term.

      Longer term though…

  17. Q&A suggesting Americans that want to leave US because of trump are considering Australia. Clearly they have not checked our Real Estate Prices. lol

    • Let them come here and get a second dose of the likes of One Nation rising to power.

      Keep an eye on the rapidly rising welfare costs. Watch what happens when the govt has to choose between increasing taxes or cutting welfare.

      • Why would Americans coming here increase welfare costs? They would most likely be working and pay more taxes than they take out.

      • Kevin,

        My welfare comment non-specifically related to Americans wishing to migrate here. Welfare costs are rising very rapidly relative to GDP. It will reach crisis point within the next few years. I mention it because I believe all hell will break lose when the govt is forced to either cut welfare and/or raise taxes. Australia about to follow Britain and USA into neo-nationalism.

      • tell them to come via boat. That would be interesting to see play out. Ultimately returned home as part of the new deal to be announced?
        people would be awarding them “bravery” medals

  18. So Trump, the man working for heartland America, is speculated to be appointing Jamie Dimon, the heartland of Wall St, as Treasury Secretary. The red flags are popping up already.

    • I wonder how silent this silent majority will be when Trump totally sells them out and keep the status quo. Trump serves trump and trump only. He is not too interested about the hard done by working class.

      • The more I look at the election campaign, the more I see inconsistencies.

        It’s a minefield as to who’s working for who. Wall St is bound to milk it for all it’s worth, and as usual, it’s the voters themselves ending up shafted.

      • I think this is the last US president in the US as we now it. system goes down in the next 4 years. People will simply refuse to trust anyone.

      • The Guardian yesterday had rolling updates on Trump’s press conference and when question on the already growing gap between retoric and delivery, Trump’s response: I won. Says it all really, mind you we have the odd one or two politicians who subscribe to that tactic.

      • Trump is going to be Turnbull on steroids. Promise change but essentially do nothing. Maybe that’s why they got on so well on that first phone call.

    • Carrots won’t work… these are addicts we are talking about. Use a stick

      Tomorrow when we wake up a note from the ATO… no interest deductibilty will be allowed in any way for corporate tax accounting for ever more. Corporations are all evil… Take away their limited liability as well. Make that joint-stock companies also.

      That is how you get rid of leverage, make it so it doesn’t pay.

    • Virus – I was borne in Macedonia and I am aware of baba Vanga but never read much about her predictions. I read the link and I just can’t see how Europe will be occupied by any Muslim country. First, technologically all Muslim world is way behind. Also, if it comes down to that Russia and USA will join the fight.
      Also, she predicts USA will be destroyed then will attack the Muslim world in order to liberate Europe. Hm..
      She did make some good calls though – from that link and from what I have heard from people talking..

  19. Would be good to revisit tax alternatives as posted below.
    I don’t see LVT as a good option other than on vacant and foreign held dwellings – maybe include corporation owned dwellings as well. Or in other words PPOR exempt from LVT.


    I liked this point:
    This before a socialism land tax.
    ‘it might be time to consider a minimum company tax, based not on actual taxable income but gross revenue. A tax of three percent on the $454 billion gross untaxed revenue of big public businesses alone would yield more than $13 billion.’

    • I would be entirely supportive of a debt based tax system, to support the recent debt is wealth situation. Imagine how many stupid taxes could be replaced with something like this:
      < 100k debt = 0% tax
      < 250k debt = 10% tax (25k)
      < 500k debt = 30% tax (150k)
      > 500k debt = 50% tax (250k plus)

      • good simple idea in the right direction Andy. Dealing with the demand side of debt issuance is the key to resolving imbalances longer term. Too many focussed on trying to control or limit supply of credit. Introduce a disincentive into the demand side is a step in the right direction. Maybe then people might think about just sticking everything on the card or re-financing the house to take that 4th foreign holiday in 2 years.

      • Minerals in ground belong to australians and is appropriate to tax, so should the money supply. Banks should not have a free-for-all to mine wallets.

  20. Pragmatic deal-making businessman, eh Malcolm. Just like you, eh Malcolm. (http://www.smh.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/prime-minister-malcolm-turnbull-calls-to-congratulate-us-presidentelect-donald-trump-20161110-gsm3ev.html). I love how Malcolm’s standing to make the call.


    Business! Success! Trickle down!

    As funny as you are, Fizza, you’ll never be as funny as clownshoes.

    PS even funnier is “Environment Minister Josh Frydenberg has conceded that it was wrong to call Mr Trump “a dropkick” during the campaign.” What in the holy fuck was the nepotistic fucker trying to do – suck up to the greens? Did Fizza make him apologise?

    • Thanks for linking to @DerorCurrency/Opinion8red, another much maligned poster who just kept saying the same thing and provided reasoning for it…

    • Well done. Especially bringing the heavy artillery to bear on the nonsense that is the ancient Free Trade Religion. It plays a crucial part in neoliberal globalist theology but the theory is nonsense built on stilts because of its implicit unrealistic assumptions. History is unkind to free trade: Germany and the USA abandoned the free trade dogma in the nineteenth century and by the century’s end were catching up and overtaking Britain economically and technologically.

    • Mark Blyth ─ Global Trumpism

      Published on Sep 29, 2016

      Watson Institute Student Seminar Series – American Democracy: The Dangers and Opportunities of Right Here and Right Now

      Designed especially with Brown undergraduates in mind, but welcoming all members of the University and wider community, this seminar series meets in the weeks both before and after Election Day to analyze what’s truly at stake in this election. In the context of American history, contemporary global politics, and current issues in U.S. social, political, and economic affairs, guest speakers will set before the seminar participants the essential issues and then facilitate probing discussions. The seminar’s goal is bear witness to a historic election, illuminating the “dangers and opportunities of right here and right now.”


      • I was about to link that one as well.
        It was up last weekend but could be reposted daily. The best presentation I’ve seen that provides context for what is happening.

      • Footsore….

        Some people have pointed out tho the inaccuracy of say a Sanders vs Trump outcome, Russia going Balkans, and a reference to the discredited Phillips Curve wrt 1945 – 1975 period w/o understanding the ideological anti union front running that made it popular.

        Dishevled Marsupial…. noone is perfect, too much scope I guess….

  21. Best take on the US election so far for me. It will take an Erdogan type purge to get these parasites off the back of the body politic.


    Check out the recent changes in the internal security apparatus in Russia, that is what is coming for the US if they get Watts type riots. The Fed will be marginalised, will they fight back ? If they do maybe we get Greenbacks if Mr Trump makes 8 years and the Treasury takes over.

    • “. I fully understand why transgender bathrooms are important” wtf? I don’t. What a strange article, felt like he was constantly apologising for pointing out the obvious to princess ninnies Dem supporters.

    • I subscribe to the theory that Trump won’t see the end of his first term, the old Republicans will find something to impeach him on and install their own hack. Remember, Trump’s an accidental Republican, there’s no love lost there.

      • Thinking exactly along those lines. And the idiot will give them the stick with which they will wack with. He only serves Trump but then again I’ve been wrong on him in the past so let’s see what happens.
        But after this presidency, regardless how long it lasts, I really believe anarchy will grip USA. People will simply stop listening to anyone from any government level and we have to remember these guys have more weapons in private hands than their army holds. Lol
        Stage is already being set by Trump as he started backing away from his core promises.

    • @ Wing Nut Time will tell, but if he is smart enough to stay above the implementation struggle you need to remember that the sort of campaign that the Republicans ran means that their legitimacy now comes from Mr Trump not the usual other way around. he could appeal to the country over their heads. It just depends if he really is interested in substantial change.

    • GunnamattaMEMBER

      Cheers Nyleta, that’s a good read, and resonates at a lot of levels.

      What I don’t think everyone is getting even yet is that it is the managerialism in the post 70s era which is a key factor in the rise of working class disenchantment. The disappearance of genuine middle class jobs – the higher clerical and well remunerated trades – is probably the factor, but it is closely linked with the rise of a type of individual in workplaces (particularly large organisation workplaces) who has no obvious skill applicable to a workplace, and generally makes little observable (particularly from the perception point of people in the workplaces) contribution to workplace outcomes, but who is the conduit for the ‘do more with less’ messages coming from on high, who will be the first point of contact for behaviour based employee performance discussions, and is in a position to leverage greater strategic awareness of the organisation direction (and generally also a direct organisational power position) to play favourites, and allocate information discriminately.

      If you follow through with the 1970s onwards marking the high point of the MBA worship era, we can see that the above also ties together with a mantra (and managerialism is a lot closer to religion in its exhortation of belief, than a science positing action and reaction according to identifiable phenomena) which at its core make subordinate employees objects of condescension and manipulation, directly leveraging a power basis which considers employees the equal of chattels, and placing managers above that in terms of rewards and expectations.

      This is the experience of a lot of the ‘working class’ of the type which the author of that piece refers to when he notes that the ‘working class’ think professors are ‘phonies’, lawyers are ‘shysters’, and doctors are ‘quacks’ – I certainly think he could have done his article a lot of favours by identifying that for many who can at least recognise that there are good doctors, lawyers and professors, there will be an overriding and more fundamental belief that ‘management’ is always bullshit, and that the managers they know are prone to being arseholes or wankers (sure there will be plenty who know ‘good’ managers, but the basic mindset will be to assume that they are wankers or arseholes until they prove otherwise).

      From there it is worth thinking about the types of jobs which have been under pressure for a generation. It is generally clerical and industrial production jobs, and the proliferation is now running towards mindlessness and services which are invariably lower paid. No wonder those people are pissed off.

      The other thing I found myself thinking about as I read that piece was (strange as it may seem) Russia. There was loads of commentary during the US Presidential election about whether there was some sort of direct link between Russia and Putin and Trump in the US, but what there wasn’t was any sort of comment about the almost Russian circumstances Trump is in. He has come to power portraying himself as being an outsider, in a world where the insiders are invariably considered corrupt, and where the electoral, legal, administrative systems are often seen to be fairly corrupt too, and where those with the access to the influence can ‘buy’ the outcomes they want to manipulate those down the tree, and enrich themselves corruptly. For mine that is a very close proxy for the sort of circumstances in which Putin rose to power – the elites were corrupt, had bought out the administration, judiciary, where a nascent capital owning class were fairly crude in their treatment of any interest but their own.

      While I have absolutely no idea whether there would be any genuine link between Putin and Trump, I would observe that they share a hatred of mainstream American politicians (Clinton in particular, and what many Russians would see as a degree of hypocrisy in their treatment of Russia) and represent largely the same demographic – that of people seeing them (Putin and Trump) as being strong outsiders stepping into sort out a legal, administrative system which has been bought out by a capitalist elite and of seeing them (over a considerable period in the case of Putin, and remains to be seen in the case of Trump) as being a preferable alternative (even if corrupt themselves and even if exhibiting beliefs and actions which those supporting them don’t necessarily agree with) to what would be the likely outcome if the leader (Putin or Trump) wasn’t there .

      And it is this – the likely alternative – which now becomes the prism through which Putin already is seen (and has been since 2000), and which Trump may well become seen. What they do (even if demonstrably corrupt and/or pandering to right wing nuttery/bigotry) is not necessarily the determining factor in their support, rather than the likely alternatives (God only knows in Russia, but mainstream political establishments in the US).

      The tie up between the two points is that it is in the first instance far more likely that a mainstream pushing globalisation, deregulation and (particularly) open immigration, is far more likely to be the one pushing managerialism (to improve efficiency, to be more competitive, to deliver a better outcome for capital owners – and to treat employees as shit, or with bullshit) which is a key factor in the disenchantment (or I actually think it has become outright hatred) that a very large number of people feel (in the US, UK, many parts of Europe, but also here). Certainly there is a case for saying the advent of large scale contracting and casual employment is a factor heightening stress (but even here it is generally management pushing it on behalf of the 1%ers).

      But I think it dead certain that the root of the anger stems from the workplace experience, and that the workplace experience leading to the anger is coming through managerialism, and managers on behalf of capital (who themselves aren’t paying taxes, and buying the wherewithal to bend the rules, and have the political mainstreams in their pocket), who have anchored themselves to a style of ‘management’ which has no more scientific validity than the priests telling Galileo the sun travelled around the earth, which is the genesis of the anger. And once the anger is created then almost anything can be planted in it – racism and bigotry for starters, but ultimately a preparedness to see the law as not being enough and to go beyond it.

      • You just summed up my 40 years working life in a brilliant way. Since year 2000 I can’t count the number of times I had to hazard my career to keep people safe. It wears you down and the real worry is the people coming through now were never given a chance to train properly.

        The corruption and hypocrisy we see all around us don’t really worry me, what does is the loss of trust in our institutions and the lapsing of the rule of law. Never before have I seen the politicians, public service and business combine to neuter our agreed laws by the simple expedient of paying off those tasked with applying the laws in such a manner in defiance of majority opinion.

      • GunnamattaMEMBER


        My money, were I to punt on such things, would be that Trump will have some serious security (more to protect him from the people who put him into power than anything else) and that he would be highly likely to take an oligarch – and I think a banker or corporate malfeasant would do nicely, were they to step out of line any time soon – and make an example of them. So that would have me suspecting he will make sure the US Military is right on side, the FBI director has already demonstrated his reliability, and there will be a corporate head on a stick sometime forthwith (presumably someone demonstrably not pro Trump).

      • Per the Mark Blyth link above the observation about wage earners feeling secure about controlling their lives dropping from 30% not long ago to 9% is a paradigm shift with ramifications as you note Gunna, fear is preferred tool to manage the unwashed.

        Janet I would caution pinning any hopes on el’trumpo considering the Obama legacy as well as your own experiences with Key. I think the recent statement by el’turmpo about reigning on campaign rhetoric was met with “I won”.

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        Geez your good a pening your thoughts Gunna, that was a good summary and analysis of nyletas link Gunna.

        That managerialism you refer to is a paticularly grating aspect of working in “High Vis” clothing,…your,

        “a mainstream pushing globalisation, deregulation and (particularly) open
        immigration, is far more likely to be the one pushing managerialism (to improve efficiency, to be more competitive, to deliver a better outcome for capital owners – and to treat employees as shit, or with bullshit) which is a key factor in the disenchantment (or I actually think it has become outright hatred) that a very large number of people feel”

        really resonates with what I see and feel.
        At FMGs cloudbreak 1700 man mining camp, where I spent 3 and a half years, the hatred of managerialism and coporate bureaucracy was palpable, esp amoungst the tradies. The weekly hour and a half long “Tool box talks” were always condesending and several individulals would always be singled out for procedural infractions, and chastised in front of a the group.
        I Found the double speak around “Safety” paticularly infuriating, with a mindless amount of bureaucratic “documentation ” required for all tasks,….my frequent suggestion that maybe we should write up some SWIs for wiping our arses properly was actually considered as a serious suggestion by one of the many revolving “Saftey advisors” we had to endure.

        On one occasion I was disciplined for stating that I had never had to sit through such a bullshit conversation in all my life!
        The conversation involved an obese 26 year old female safety advisor who had never picked up a tool in her life, lecturing, in a condesending manner, a 62 year old electrician who only filled in one “5 steps” (a small, later archived, piece of paper with a bunch of boxes to tick and a bunck of lines on the back to write down potential hazards assioated with said task.)
        Who only filled in 1 “5 Steps” per day for changing a light globe even though he changed up 20 per day!
        Why had he not filled in 20!

        All of this has nothing to do with Saftey of cource, but rather its a bureaucratic and para legal system of documentation designed to divert responsibility for any injury onto the individual rather than a superior or the company. I was told on numerous occasions to stop telling everybody this fact.
        “Safety breaches” where the primary way of getting rid of people they didnt want, and the only way of avoiding HR involvement.

        Coming from a Sydney construction background, I was stunned that I was one of less than dozen people in a Union on this 1700 man camp!(FMG is overtly anti union )
        I used to say to them, you’ve all only got yourselves to blame, your lack of solidarity is laughable, that why you all get treated like shit,…about then someone would always bring up the Footy, they were AFL mad over there, id go back to my Iphone. sigh.

      • EP – site safety gurus are mostly total dicks, workers loathe them, management suffers them (because it has to) and an extraordinary number of them would struggle to change a lightbulb.

    • Brilliant article. It is interesting that working class resent professionals. It makes sense I guess. They clearly don’t realise some of us are fighting their corner rather than accusing them of being racist.

    • very good article but can’t agree with all of the content.
      She speaks of high school educated white working class men resentment towards professionals. – Well for that all should thank our Universities that produce one-dimensional tools with zero creativity – they can produce polished presentations but with laughable content. But then again they are hired as managers by default over high school educated person that has read over 1000 books, traveled the world and knows the industry inside-out.
      I have worked with so many graduates in my company and so far I have only come up across one that I can confidently say he did earn his degree and he really knows his stuff. He always asked questions when I took him on my team. Rest I would not hire them to polish my shoes. And I am high school educated (the only high school person in the family of economists, judges, teachers etc.)
      Then she also played the gender card – This is true to a point but did not determined the final result. I am sure lot of Bernie supporters either voted Trump or did not vote at all and we all know why.
      Then she claims it was not fair to call Clinton “nasty woman” – well I am sorry but wiki leaks emails presented more than enough evidence to call Clinton lot worse. She is simply a corrupted politician that should be locked up. Still on same subject of unfairness – “unqualified due to past mistakes”- really? Those past mistakes translated into loss of lot of lives. For god sake if this does not disqualifies you to be POTUS then nothing will.

      BTW – If I was US citizen I would have voted Jill Stein – Greens. So just for the record I don’t like Trump at all. But if I had absolutely no choice I would have voted for Trump knowing upfront I am voting for an idiot. I think lot of US citizens voted Trump for the very same reason and not because he has limited vocabulary and that appeals/resonates more with the blue color workforce or worse because he is a man – these days blue color workforce can read as well – it is not shovels and pitchforks tools industry only.

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Looks like Donald just cracked a joke about his plan to grab Merkel on the Pussy when he meets her.
      And, How, Deep down she really wants him to.

      • Caption:
        Trump: I Then put my thumb out like this … And before I knew it – I nearly lost my wrist-watch in there.
        Farage: Ha-haaa… Classic Donald! Should patent that move…

      • Exactly. Bugger Berlusconi. A real woman wants a real man. Trump got more female vote than the HRC Camp thought possible. ‘Cos power sex and money are elemental.

    • Caption should read: Trump meets Captain Coward who abandoned the oarless Brexit canoe as it floated down shitcreek.

    • I can’t stop looking at Nigel’s hand. It’s huge!

      And is that Australia on his lapel badge?

      • hahaha its massive and disproportionate. Probably been wrapped around something equally disproportionate.
        Cut it out you lot, I meant an outsized pint glass!! Besides I think he is right handed.
        The pin got me as well, it was my exact thought but upon 2nd glance it looks like a US v UK flags set up
        but good spot though

  22. afr

    Nov 11
    Bill Shorten targets workers as Malcolm Turnbull targets Tony Abbott

    Opposition Leader Bill Shorten has the 457 visa program in his sights as he vows he will not sit by and watch blue collar workers desert the Labor Party as they have the United States Democrats.

    As the election of Donald Trump reopened the wounds between Tony Abbott and Malcolm Turnbull and stoked the culture wars, Mr Shorten said his pursuit of an aggressive Australia-first approach to policy did not mean Labor would resort to protectionism.

    But it would run the rule more closely over future policy to ensure workers were not left behind. This will include taking a tougher approach to trade deals and 457 visas for imported workers.

    “Economic growth has to lift all boats, not just the yachts,” Mr Shorten told AFR Weekend.

    “We’re not going to lose our blue-collar voters like the Democrats did.”

    Queensland tour

    Mr Shorten will spend next week touring regional Queensland where there are high levels of disaffected voters, similar to those who opted for Mr Trump.

    On Thursday, as the political establishment grappled with the consequences of the US election, Mr Shorten said “my party will heed the lessons of Detroit, Michigan, of Ohio and Pennsylvania”.

    “We will buy Australian, build Australian, make in Australia and employ Australians. We will not leave people behind.”

    He cited 457 visas and employers who “abuse our visa system to import and exploit cheap labour” and trade deals “which don’t deliver the blue-collar jobs for those hurt by these agreements”.

    Shadow foreign affairs minister Penny Wong said on Friday Labor had not made a final decision on whether it would support the Trans-Pacific Partnership, a regional 12-nation free trade deal, but that didn’t matter because Mr Trump was not going to ratify it.

    Concerns about the TPP

    “We’ve raised concerns about it. We hadn’t come to a final position. We obviously were awaiting consideration by the final parliamentary committee. But I think that’s all become quite academic now,” she said.

    Inside the Coalition, the Trump victory was creating chaos with Mr Abbott and Mr Turnbull attacking each other.

    Mr Turnbull said it was Mr Abbott’s 2014 budget, specifically the proposed Medicare co-payment, which had significantly damaged voter trust in Australian politics.

    “The Medi-Scare, Labor’s campaign, was outrageous, it was dishonest, it was fraudulent in fact, in what they did and the way they set out to frighten older and vulnerable people,” he said.

    “But the question for my party and for me and my government, is why were people able to be frightened?

    “The answer is that I think this stemmed from the 2014 budget and the co-payment. They felt that they’d been let down, it had come as a shock and what we have to do is rebuild the trust of the Australian people in our administration.”

    Abbott: voters will look elsewhere

    Mr Abbott had earlier warned that voters who were unhappy with conventional standard bearers in modern politics would look for alternatives, and “this is something that mainstream politicians ignore at their peril”.

    “If you don’t have a strong centre-right party … people who are looking for what might broadly be described as conservative positions will find other voices to represent them,” he said.

    Mr Abbott suggested Mr Turnbull had transformed into such a centre-right leader since the election.

    “It’s quite interesting … that if you actually listen to the Prime Minister, there’s been a lot less talk about innovation and agility and the new economy, a lot more talk about national security and border security.

    “A lot more talk about cost of living and the need to reject Labor’s 50 per cent renewable energy target, which will result in a $50 billion overbuild of surplus power capacity and everyone will be paying that through their power bills,” Mr Abbott said.

    © Copyright 2016 Fairfax Media Publications Pty Ltd
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    Read more: http://www.afr.com/news/politics/bill-shorten-targets-workers-as-malcolm-turnbull-targets-tony-abbott-20161111-gsn8j7#ixzz4PrEArzvR
    Follow us: @FinancialReview on Twitter | financialreview on Facebook

      • Do you know what this reminds me of…the debate on Same-Sex Marriage (or lack thereof). Anyone who holds a view that a traditional view of marriage is preferred gets shouted down as “full of hatred” or a “bigot” or worse. Even worse, once I said that I saw why some people held that we should not legalise same sex marriage (I actually have no preference either way) and I got called everything under the sun, but mainly a fool and ridiculous for allowing the thought to pop into my head that people who hold a traditional view of marriage can do so with some sense of reasonableness. Now Malcolm Turnbull is not allowed to go to the Mardi Gras because they can’t handle the idea of a plebiscite. I think it was quite a reasonable solution to the change of the laws to hold a plebiscite, but I think that perhaps the Australian public is not so clear cut on wanting same-sex marriage as what the proponents want to portray.

      • Good advice but I’ll never be able to forgive Shorten and Wong for their cowardice and rolling over on Chafta.

    • Economic growth has to lift all boats, not just the yachts

      F#ck off shorten, what about people who don’t own boats *cough* houses? C#nt

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        I like your Style Mig,
        your Intelligent, Courageous, Angry and not affraid to tell someone, they are full of Shit.

        You are just the kind of young fellow traveler we need,… to help stage, a rank and file take over of the Labor Party! and put it back on its propper course!

        You Know its the only way Brother.

        Come on Comrade, Feel the Solidarity and never forget,…You’ll always be a son of the Working Class!

      • The victorian Labour branch can’t even be democratic in preselection, rejecting democratic process opportunity.
        Whilst wong is there, noone will believe Labour about anything! Great speech she made just before Trump’s victory.

    • Err.. Mr Shorten its too late you have already lost those voters. You will discover to your chagrin that I (and others no doubt) will take ‘some’ convincing that you and the ALP are anything but what you are, that is neo-liberal traitors of the workers.

  23. Phew, for a moment there I thought Labor leader had used the words ‘working class’, but I double checked and he hadn’t. Wouldn’t want to break a decades old taboo, now. People might start asking who this Marx dude was.

  24. ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

    Its not the Working class against the Capitalist class within the “left wing” parties,…its the “Professional” class against the “Dummies” who should have done better in school.

    Could Meritocracy have been the very thing that put Trump in power?


  25. Can’t believe this fuckwit still get’s a hearing:

    “Reagan guru says Trump will usher in new boom era”

    Donald Trump’s plan for sweeping tax cuts and deregulation will spur a US economic boom that could “last for generations” if the president-elect resists a lurch towards protectionism, according to an architect of “Reaganomics”.

    Arthur Laffer, who advised Republican president Ronald Reagan in the 1980’s and UK Conservative prime minister Margaret Thatcher, said lower, broader-based taxes, together with “minimal regulation” and free trade would “recreate the pre-conditions” for “enormous economic growth” in the world’s largest economy.


    Here’s a red hot tip for ya Laffer, you’re the reason Trump was voted in and not because your shit ideas were a raging success.

  26. GunnamattaMEMBER

    Here is Donald Trump’s plan for his first 100 days – Vox.com

    My thoughts on them (and/or public reception for them, implications of them)

    * FIRST, propose a Constitutional Amendment to impose term limits on all members of Congress – Yeah OK, I reckon that is an idea with a reasonable basis

    * SECOND, a hiring freeze on all federal employees to reduce federal workforce through attrition (exempting military, public safety, and public health); – Maybe a good idea, but the regulatory gaps which open up because of it would presumably become a gateway for the 1% set to exploit the economy one way or another

    * THIRD, a requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated; – Maybe a have some merit initially but will ultimately open up lots of legal/regulatory gaps for the 1% set to exploit the economy one way or another

    * FOURTH, a 5 year-ban on White House and Congressional officials becoming lobbyists after they leave government service; – completely agree with that and would like to see it mandated in Australia

    * FIFTH, a lifetime ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government; – completely agree with that and would like to see it mandated for Australia

    * SIXTH, a complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections. – completely agree with that and would like to see it mandated for Australia

    * FIRST, I will announce my intention to renegotiate NAFTA or withdraw from the deal under Article 2205 – no firm opinion, though one suspects it could unpin global free trade – if the poster child of the benefits of free trade goes that has to cause ripples – and would likely have a deleterious effect economic effect on that basis alone.

    * SECOND, I will announce our withdrawal from the Trans-Pacific Partnership – agree with that. I dont think the TPP is about economics but about global politics. (which isnt to say any other potential hegemons economic ideas would be superior)

    * THIRD, I will direct my Secretary of the Treasury to label China a currency manipulator – is there any real doubt that China IS a currency manipulator? (and from there is there any doubt that Japan is likewise?)

    * FOURTH, I will direct the Secretary of Commerce and U.S. Trade Representative to identify all foreign trading abuses that unfairly impact American workers and direct them to use every tool under American and international law to end those abuses immediately – Good luck with that, but I dont think there would be impact without economic pain. More likely that the attempt to identify issues would become a tool for Trump to pressure corporates and identities he didnt like (a tool for corruption) and that the benefits of that would only marginally be for workers (but more likely for magnates on Trump’s side)

    * FIFTH, I will lift the restrictions on the production of $50 trillion dollars’ worth of job-producing American energy reserves, including shale, oil, natural gas and clean coal. – I tend to see this as pressuring the Saudi’s (and possibly a useful tool if he has issues with Russia. Will blow climate change mitigation out of the water though.

    * SIXTH, lift the Obama-Clinton roadblocks and allow vital energy infrastructure projects, like the Keystone Pipeline, to move forward – as above

    * SEVENTH, cancel billions in payments to U.N. climate change programs and use the money to fix America’s water and environmental infrastructure – would blow US leverage over global organisations out of the water (and its role globally probably too). Would presumably lead to a race for the bottom on climate – meaning burn baby burn, and geo-engineer around the problems later on

    * FIRST, cancel every unconstitutional executive action, memorandum and order issued by President Obama – lays the basis for a very bitter reversal if he cant bring the economy around to better the lives of people who have put him into power, and potentially a benchmark in how all future presidents treat their predecessors. Very risky seeing as it appears that Clinton won the popular vote by circa a million

    * SECOND, begin the process of selecting a replacement for Justice Scalia from one of the 20 judges on my list, who will uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States – presumably par for the course in the US

    * THIRD, cancel all federal funding to Sanctuary Cities – no idea on this

    * FOURTH, begin removing the more than 2 million criminal illegal immigrants from the country and cancel visas to foreign countries that won’t take them back – good luck with that, could also play havoc with foreign relations

    * FIFTH, suspend immigration from terror-prone regions where vetting cannot safely occur. All vetting of people coming into our country will be considered extreme vetting. – may seem a good idea in the US, but would presumably have implications for Europe and be likely to cause issues for US interests in those regions

    • interested partyMEMBER

      It’s the carbon bomb that has me thinking….. all the rest is noise in the big picture.

      • Yep.
        A few weeks ago I read the latest CSIRO ‘State of the Climate’ report. We are already in trouble, even if we start changes that will cut back back the CO² output. If Trump’s policies go through we won’t cut back. Mark Blyth’s line on it was that nothing will get done until the water starts lapping at the doors of beach front condos. By the time that happens there will already be climate change induced humanitarian crises adding to the chaos in Africa and the Middle East. The refugee issue of today will seem trivial in comparison.

      • “We are already in trouble” Yeah except all the reality

        Arctic summers ice-free ‘by 2013’


      • http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/warming-up-new-research-points-to-a-more-sensitive-climate-to-rising-co2-20161113-gso3z0.html

        Vs the flat earthers….

        US Republicans are expected to axe billions of dollars in climate finance when they take the White House and Congress in January.

        Funds to help poor countries adapt to the impacts of global warming and develop sustainably will be redirected to domestic priorities.

        “We are going to cancel billions in payments to the UN climate change programmes and use the money to fix America’s water and environmental infrastructure,” said President-elect Donald Trump said in his 22 October Gettysburg address.

        With a Republican majority in the Senate and House of Representatives, there appears to be little standing in his way.

        “That brings a fear to African countries,” Akabiwa Nyambe, a Zambian official, told Climate Home at a side meeting of COP22 climate talks in Marrakech. “We have been looking forward to the US bringing a lot of funding into projects… It drops our faces.”

        Delegates are pinning their hopes on international pressure to prompt a rethink. Many say it is too early to tell how Trump will govern. He has already backtracked on a pledge to scrap Obamacare, the incumbent’s core health policy.

        Rachel Kyte, head of the UN’s Sustainable Energy for All programme, said Trump did not have a mandate to reverse US climate finance commitments. “All developed countries made promises,” she said. “A promise made has to be a promise kept.”

        Notably, the US promised $3 billion towards the UN-backed Green Climate Fund, of which just $500m has been delivered. The outstanding sum is a major chunk of the $10bn seed money donated to the flagship scheme.

        UN institutions are also vulnerable. The Republicans have been gunning for the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) since it accepted Palestine as a full party earlier this year.


        Disheveled Marsupial…. sea ice is a single data point in a plethora of multidisciplinary approach to reconciling AGW…. in counterpoise [for some] we have the absurd economics over around a half century [even tho it was informed]….

  27. I know this is could be one off thingy but I think Med price in Syd and Mel is down amid high clearance rates. Would be interesting to see if this trend continues which could mean people selling at discount in order to get out before the rush or could be just a one off thingy. lol

  28. TailorTrashMEMBER

    losing is not always the end ………..sometimes it can be the birth …….


    [Foreword in the
    Chinese edition
    of “Beautiful Losers]

    Dear Reader,
    Thank you for coming to this book. It is an honor, and a surprise, to have the frenzied thoughts of my youth expressed in Chinese characters. I sincerely appreciate the efforts of the translator and the publishers in bringing this curious work to your attention. I hope you will find it useful or amusing.

    When I was young, my friends and I read and admired the old Chinese poets. Our ideas of love and friendship, of wine and distance, of poetry itself, were much affected by those ancient songs. Much later, during the years when I practiced as a Zen monk under the guidance of my teacher Kyozan Joshu Roshi, the thrilling sermons of Lin Chi (Rinzai) were studied every day. So you can understand, Dear Reader, how privileged I feel to be able to graze, even for a moment, and with such meager credentials, on the outskirts of your tradition.

    This is a difficult book, even in English, if it is taken too seriously. May I suggest that you skip over the parts you don’t like? Dip into it here and there. Perhaps there will be a passage, or even a page, that resonates with your curiosity. After a while, if you are sufficiently bored or unemployed, you may want to read it from cover to cover. In any case, I thank you for your interest in this odd collection of jazz riffs, pop-art jokes, religious kitsch and muffled prayer � an interest which indicates, to my thinking, a rather reckless, though very touching, generosity on your part.

    Beautiful Losers was written outside, on a table set among the rocks, weeds and daisies, behind my house on Hydra, an island in the Aegean Sea. I lived there many years ago. It was a blazing hot summer. I never covered my head. What you have in your hands is more of a sunstroke than a book.

    Dear Reader, please forgive me if I have wasted your time.

    Los Angeles, February 27, 2000

    Leonard Cohen

  29. Every time moon gets close to earth gravity pull triggers earthquakes. Another one huts New Zealand.

      • Actually San Andreas is overdue for a big one. And as a matter of fact California is moving towards Canada in terms of tectonics. They may end up getting what they wished for. In 100k years from now. Lol

      • Few things would reshape America and the world more than if corrupt mind control that emanates from Hollywood, and the corrupt finance that comes from Wall Street, were succeed from the Union.