Will Omicron end or extend the pandemic?

Two preliminary schools of thought have emerged regarding to the nascent Omicron strain of the coronavirus.

The optimistic view is that the Omicron strain, while very contagious, could be actually far less lethal than the Delta or earlier strains. If this is the case, then Omicron could spread rapidly among the world’s population, become the dominant strain, effectively vaccinate the world, deliver ‘herd immunity’ and end the pandemic.

This view was put forward as a hypothesis by former deputy Chief Health Officer Nick Coatesworth and others:

“If this is milder than delta, you actually want it to spread as quickly as possible. You want it to out-compete delta and become the predominant circulating virus.

“On current evidence I think it will. We should know the answer in a matter of days”…

Dr Rob Grenfell, a special health adviser at CSIRO, says omicron could turn out to be a good thing for living with the virus. “If this is less serious and becomes the dominant variant then it could be the next step in living with COVID-19”…

Dr Benjamin Schwessinger, an evolutionary biologist from the Australian National University… says the best option for humans is to have the virus follow the fate of the Spanish flu. One theory says it mutated itself up an evolutionary dead end. Another said it became the common cold or flu.

On the other side of the ledger, professor Stuart Turville cautions that “the history of SARS-CoV-2 variants has not been that they’ve become less severe over time”:

Based largely on one South African doctor who has treated a number of Omicron cases and has noted mild and different symptoms, a narrative has taken hold that SARS-CoV-2 may mimic respiratory viruses like H1NI influenza and the common cold, which started out as a deadly Russian flu, and mutate into a more benign virus…

Stuart Turville is an associate professor in the Immunology and Pathogenesis Program at the Kirby Institute… [He] cautions against any assumption that viruses by and large become less severe over time with increasing mutations…

“The reality with viruses is it’s each to their own,” Professor Turville says. “There are lots of examples where that hasn’t happened. “I’d say that what we know from all of the variants that are out there, I don’t think we’ve seen one that’s really gone down in severity.

“On the question of is this virus going to peter out, that particular question is going to be the hardest one to ask epidemiology and it will probably take us months to know whether that looks like being the case. It will probably be well into 2022 until we get clear data on that epidemiologically.”

Professor Turville also notes that in the early days of the Delta outbreak, experts were opining that it looked like being less severe:

“There was a lot of talk coming out of the data coming out of England that Delta was less severe, but you were talking about a country that had high levels of infection in the past and also high levels of vaccination,” Professor Turville says. “As it turned out, if you look to countries like South Africa, and those lower vaccine uptake, the disease severity looked pretty similar to previous strains”…

Those in South Africa who have caught Omicron are also relatively early in their disease progression and may become more ill as time goes on.

The bottom line is that nobody really knows what’s going on with Omicron and it is far too early to draw conclusions.

Hopefully it will end up following the optimistic path put forward by Nick Coatesworth, thereby effectively ending the pandemic. But it could also go the other way and cause another wave of infections, hospitalisations and deaths.

The best thing for Australia’s authorities to do is err on the side of caution, restrict international arrivals, and implement quarantine until the science around Omicron is settled.

Unconventional Economist
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Comments

  1. Unbelievable spruiking online about how ‘mild’ this variant is.

    Except there is no evidence for that yet.

    I wonder why?

    • The Penske FileMEMBER

      Agree. But there’s also no evidence that it’s as hyper dangerous and about to wipe out life like the Delta variant was.

    • Fishing72MEMBER

      No evidence…..except for every single case being either extremely mild or symptom free.

      Doesn’t mean we can’t all PANIC!!!!!!!!

      • FUDINTHENUDMEMBER

        I’ve gotta say, the term “extremely mild” doesn’t sound very scientific. Seems like a real oxymoron to be trying to minimize some thing to the “EXTREME”

        • Fishing72MEMBER

          There hasn’t been a single symptomatic “case” amongst the Europeans who’ve tested positive for Omicron. The South African covid health adviser stated that the worst symptom she’d seen was two days of fatigue AKA a bad hangover. I feel no hesitation in describing those symptoms as mild. I’ve done hard days physical labour which made me lazy and tired for a couple of days…..you think we should shut down society in case people feel listless for a couple of days?

          Find me a single case of Omicron anywhere on the face of the planet which is harsher than feeling a bit off your game for a day or two and then I’ll concede that your attempts at sounding clever are justified. It’s not myself who’s minimising anything, it’s the media who are going full reta3d with the scare campaign. Closing the international borders because some people got tired over the weekend is utterly irrational and built off previous bouts of irrationality, not genuine rational risk assessment…..and that’s coming from someone who wants the borders to remain shut.

          • Most earlier variant cases were also “Mild”.
            You literally need to get tested to even know if you have it in most cases.

          • FUDINTHENUDMEMBER

            fair enough. See what data comes out with time i guess.

            Wasn’t having a go. Just pointing out that “extremely mild” (not your words) is poor english

          • Jumping jack flash

            There is an underlying agenda to push forward new vaccine technology, solely for new technology’s sake, which must be done under the cover of global panic and aided by the governments. This agenda has been revealed.

            So there’s that.

            One of the chief proponents of this agenda is running this entire dog and pony show in the US…

            mRNA vaccines are now supposedly the “world standard” for “beating the virus” yet they have been proved marginally effective at best, and highly questionable and suspect at worst. More information is being revealed all the time about how they have fudged trials.

            One of the main arguments against Omicron being a mild variant is that 20 and 30 year olds have caught it and they typically have less severe symptoms…. thats a bit telling. What are they really saying? Either they have milder symptoms with Omicron compared to Delta, or they have the same when compared to others in that age group and level of fitness.. i really dont understand what their point is in saying that except to obfuscate.

      • Anders Andersen

        Fishing72 & Joe Green,

        Did either of you read the article? Oh, you did but of course vi a your day jobs you know more. Please apply for the CMO position.

        J_J_F,

        ” This agenda has been revealed.”

        Really? Where and when did that occur?

        Yeah, this whole pandemic has been organised by KOAS.

        My God, there are only two options: cry or laugh!

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        Especially when they enforce draconian rules for the citizenry and vilify and segregate the unvaxxed at the same time.
        Our “leaders” are Total cnts

        • We’ll all be ‘un waxxed’ ( even if you’re currently fully waxxed) if you don’t comply with the coming booster requirements.
          Is the biggest Trojan Horse ever these scary viruses; is all about control and individual monitoring to force compliance.
          The ‘already risen’ ( and expanding fast) tyrannical corporate state *will* stop at nothing to feed it’s insatiable greed.
          Better be a ‘good’ globalist citizen or you will be de-selected from all aspects of the coming society and it will be radically different than what we had before.

      • MountainGuinMEMBER

        100 percent. Didn’t close the gate and are taking a wait and see approach as at least 1 infected person has been out and about.
        Scomo’s lack of quarantine investment continues to limit the management options.

      • FUDINTHENUDMEMBER

        yeh apparently omicron exposure sites in NSW include coles, aldi, target and a woolies. It’s out and a bout now. Better hope it’s “mild”..

      • Turns out it was in Europe well before it was found in S Africa. The only way to stop the virus moving around the world is to stop all movement. Indefinitely.
        If you don’t want to do that (and I don’t), then expect more of this.

        • Frank DrebinMEMBER

          Or just have sensible quarantine settings in place.

          Current settings of pre-flight testing and 3 days quarantine seem pretty reasonable to me.

    • Without comparing the level of hospitalisations to those that were admitted in the previous wave any uptick in hospital admissions is meaningless. Cases have increased from about 260 a day to over 4000. Of course more people will be admitted to hospital. The question is whether its 10% of cases like previous variants or 1% of cases of a much milder variant. Obviously 1% of 4000 cases is more than 10% of 260 cases. Maths. Its useful.

      And if you look today, hospital admissions this week are actually the lowest they have been in months. 278 compared to 9825 a few months ago.
      https://www.nicd.ac.za/diseases-a-z-index/disease-index-covid-19/surveillance-reports/daily-hospital-surveillance-datcov-report/

      • Frank DrebinMEMBER

        Agreed – this should actually be the headlines for most media articles.

        Instead we get the breathless reporting of “one positive Covid case DISCOVERED – local community is right to start panicking !”.

  2. Median age of population in S Africa = 27. It’s going to look relatively benign in that young a population.

    Maybe omicron will be the first variant to be less severe than its predecessor. Maybe.

    • Fishing72MEMBER

      Are you aware that “aversion age” does not mean the country is populated exclusively by 27 year olds? Does the reality that South Africa is home to millions of older people cross your mind when you make statements such as the above?

      And if covid is expected to have less effect on the young then why are people clamouring to demand that everyone down to five year olds is vaccinated?

      • Are you aware that “aversion age” does not mean the country is populated exclusively by 27 year olds? Does the reality that South Africa is home to millions of older people cross your mind when you make statements such as the above?
        Of course. But it is a simple metric. The more useful statistic is the population pyramid and the % older than 70 and the % older than 80. This is a key reason why China is less affected than Europe or ISA. In some countries, you die of something else before you reach the age that C19 poses a real danger to you.
        The doctor in that article quoted her experience seeing a 30 yr old with omicron and that he was well. Of course he was.

        And if covid is expected to have less effect on the young then why are people clamouring to demand that everyone down to five year olds is vaccinated?
        2 years has shown that C19 does have less effect on the young. There is no other infectious disease I am aware of that is so skewed towards the elderly. I have NFI why we are vaccinating kids. It is not supported by our experience to date.

        • Fishing72MEMBER

          The China comparison is incorrect. With a population of 1.4billion people the number of elderly Chinese is measured in the hundreds of millions. This is the only statistic that matters, not the ratio of elderly to the young. The Chinese fatality number is either a complete lie or much more reflective of the genuine threat of Covid than any statistics emerging from somewhere like the US where the virus is so heavily politicised that the media would have you appear it appears to have orange skin and a shoddy comb-over under a microscope.

          • Rubbish – other than the bit about China figures being incorrect.
            Per capita comparisons rather than absolute numbers are the way to understand this.

        • Yes, while it’s improved for many there is still a large number of people living in very poor overcrowded conditions. Also there is a good number of overweight – morbidly obese, both of which would reduce the positives of being a young population.

  3. C'est de la folieMEMBER

    Here is John Campbell

    https://youtu.be/cdkCVeWc1pQ

    The take away is seems to be less severe in presentation at hospital. Less severe for vaccinated (remembering SA is mainly unvaccinated or half vaccinated)

    A mate in Moscow has told me overnight he has had Covid, his description of his effects is encapsulated below. Sputnik is the Russian vaccine (similar to AstraZeneca)

    ‘Yes mate, fully vaccinated with two shots of Sputnik V. I didn’t get it bad. I wasn’t hospitalised, thankfully. I just had a high temperature for a few days, very bad aching joints (needed strong painkillers so I could sleep) and then loss of smell/taste. The worst thing was the total lethargy. I had no energy at all – for three weeks.’.

    • reusachtigeMEMBER

      Sh1t man, that’s scary. Reminds of the time back in earlyish 2020 when my taste and smell went all metallic. It’s a horrible experience when your chateau lafite tastes like liquid steel. I wouldn’t wish that on anyone.

    • Mr SquiggleMEMBER

      that’s alot of guess work from Dr John. He normally leans towards quoting other sources, but most of this vid seems to be his own guesses.
      I was very interested to see him float the idea that the SinoVac vaccine, or other whole of virus vaccines, may provide better protection, given its efficacy is not as spike dependent as the vaccines we are restricted to.

  4. Assisted by UN and god squad, the humans’ most insane environmental aggression has been to nearly quadruple their numbers just during my lifetime. But it’s deemed racialist to even mention it and it’s doubtful any helpful virus can fix it. That the 8b humans can get so exercised by 5m deaths tells you a lot more about them than about viruses.

  5. The only takeaway at the moment is that Omicron appears to pose a significant reinfection risk – given most of SA was already exposed to covid. Which doesn’t suggest it’s mild at all. It also completely debunks the anti vaxxers claim that “natural immunity” is stronger protection v the vaccine.
    Has anyone put their hand up yet and admitted they were wrong about that? No.

    • What it seems to imply is that both natural immunity and the vaccines aren’t going to be very effective at preventing reinfection, like colds and flu.

    • At the end of the day it boils down to behavior regardless of vaccination status and dealing with the aerosol dramas.

    • Fishing72MEMBER

      Scientific community: Omicron doesn’t appear to be a serious disease based on all available evidence. The strain appears in clinics reality as literally no worse than a flu.

      Sweeper: I told you we are all dying from Covid right at this moment! It’s just a matter of whether something else such as old age actually takes us out before hand. It will ge5 us all in the end even if it takes an average of 90 years to finally take you out. No one is safe! Who is willing to admit I’m right and that we all need to get our affairs in order….though theres going to be no one left alive to enjoy the inherited wealth.

        • Fishing72MEMBER

          How about you troll through the bowels of the internet to contradict me whilst I go and get a coffee? I’m not your employee bloke.

          It shouldn’t be too hard for you to find a single scrap of evidence that the most impactful issue in the world today has any merit behind the horror story. Get to it.

          • The onus is on you to back your personal opinions, more so you should do so initially without having to be asked, otherwise its just unsubstantiated pettifoggery. And yes I have had a look at those down playing the risk/s, those that have taken others out of context and then pulled up on it by the original authors, and the push by MSM and politically driven sorts to push that narrative.

            PS she stamps her pretty little shoes is a weak retort.

          • And you can’t substantiate anything one way or another, but feel compelled to add something that has no value swamp. I mean its not hard to distinguish the Corporate media and its captured political apparatus pushing/selling this narrative after doubling down on a failed strategy. Your ideological bias can’t have it both ways.

          • Come on Swamp … 72 just used the phrase “Scientific Community” like it vindicated his biases seeking preferences just by flinging it out there, when pulled up on it had a pejorative filled tanty about proving/attributing to his sources so they could be independently verified.

            Problem with that is it opens it up to falsification and with it the assumed authority being projected, can’t have that now can we.

            Its quite the show to on one hand carry on about corporate media and captured political groups, yet as soon as it serves up some perspective that conforms to their biased hopes they shovel it for them freely …. what a show … then expect to be taken seriously later on …

          • Whilst the scientific community has not stated any such thing directly, they are beholden to relate clinical truths. At such time there is no evidence to contradict the claim that the strain is no worse than the flu, whilst there is quite the clinical case profile to support the claim.

          • Again 72 your proclamations without attribution are just vacuous opinions. The scientific community I watch is not beholden political ideology[theology] or any profit driven businesses.

            “Last week Dr. Anthony Fauci made perhaps the most damning confession in the Covid vaccine saga. So far-reaching are the implications of his statement that the interview in which he made it may well prove a turning point in the fight against the great vaccine fraud that is being perpetrated on the peoples of the world.

            In a November 12 podcast session with the New York Times, Fauci was forced to admit the fact that the vaccines do not reliably protect their recipients from serious Covid or death.

            Called upon to explain the data coming from Israel – a country with one of the highest vaccination rates in the world – Fauci said the following:

            “They are seeing a waning of immunity not only against infection but against hospitalization and to some extent death, which is starting to now involve all age groups. It isn’t just the elderly” [emphasis added].

            In other words, the vaccines’ protective efficacy wanes not only in regard to the threat of infection, but also in regard to severe Covid and death. Speaking about the effectiveness of the vaccines in countries with high vaccination rates, Fauci admitted:

            “It’s waning to the point that you’re seeing more and more people getting breakthrough infections, and more and more of those people who are getting breakthrough infections are winding up in the hospital.”

            Even though Fauci tries to palliate the hard impact of his answer in soft language, the harsh truth behind his words is painfully evident.

            Fauci’s words amount to the admission that the vaccinated are getting infected and more and more of them are ending up in hospital where they keep succumbing to Covid at increasing rates.” – snip

            Suggest you familiarize yourself with the term “philanthrocapitalism” and how that with neoliberalism has shaped the reality we now live in …

          • Mr SquiggleMEMBER

            Skippy, that Fauci interview isnt landmark at all, he’s just warming everybody up for the booster regime.

            Fauci=mRNA=lifetime of booster shots

          • Fishing72MEMBER

            Those Fauci quotes are very interesting. Got a link to that article please ?

            It basically undermines the entire premise of mandated vaccination.

    • FUDINTHENUDMEMBER

      Whats this assumption about things being “natural” being somehow better? Nature is out to kill us fcken!

      Flesh eating bacteria, AIDS/HIV, floods, wildfires, piranhas, sharks, tapeworm, snakes, spiders, scorpions, cancer. Just off the top of me head. Nature is fcken great, but it’s not here to be nice and gentle to us.

      • Frank DrebinMEMBER

        Reminds me of Scomo’s new election slogan:

        “Man vs Nature: how we’re winning the war !!”.

      • I always have a chuckle when people crap on about saving “nature”. I remind them that she’s killed off 99.99% of all life that ever lived! She a mean biatch that don’t give a feck – we might wanna start considering what needs to be truly done to save ourselves.

  6. “, which started out as a deadly Russian flu, and mutate into a more benign virus…”
    As has been claimed about all the various diseases throughout history as humans adapted, yet when these “benign” versions were transported to the new world they were back in full force wiping out the native populations. Kinda makes it look like the humans mutated more than the virus…

  7. Why does the term “herd immunity” still get trotted out when its a scientific impossibility, furthermore even if it became dominate due to being 2X more infectious than delta, in a short space of time, that does not stop it from mutating i.e. has anyone considered more people being infect equals more opportunity too mutate uncontrollably.

    Oh yeah … its being trotted out by our version of Fauci – Coatesworth and Co. Bernays PR about living with covid because rule number one and two of Markets …

    I’ve linked numerous times to the Taleb et al paper on risk and the failures of modeling to date, but yeah, decades of corporatist neoliberal atomistic individualism freedumb memes and tropes spread through media and advertising has dumbed down populations so much that if elites wanted to cull the herd a bit they would do it to themselves freely[tm] ….

    Its nuts to watch one ideological political tribe make getting an experimental leaky vaccination a virtue signal whilst its opposite number substitutes self inflicted ignorance as a virtue signal – yet both are determined to spread the virus with abandon. Either way both can blame the other for new variants whilst Corporate Profits are on all time high and with it more political leverage in determining how society is administered.

    • “Its nuts to watch one ideological political tribe make getting an experimental leaky vaccination a virtue signal whilst its opposite number substitutes self inflicted ignorance as a virtue signal – yet both are determined to spread the virus with abandon. Either way both can blame the other for new variants whilst Corporate Profits are on all time high and with it more political leverage in determining how society is administered.”

      Quoted for truth.

    • Fauci and Coatsworth have nothing in common Skippy.
      Coatsworth is loved by the media – so draw your own conclusions re. competency.

      • That you are ignorant of Fauci past is your drama and not mine, making it political foot ball further invalidates your claims to anything to do with science.

          • Fauci is a key player in setting up Big Pharma in running pubic health policies since his unethical actions during the AIDs episode. Coatsworth is not anywhere in the same league of misdeeds as Fauci as he is decades ahead of Coatsworth and gets his guidance right from the top.

          • In addition I have pointed out IM Docs personal experiences to do with the man, add on Kennedy’s book, which I don’t blindly ascribe to everything, but, the overall thrust is accurate and more importantly the acts of Fauci that are contradictory to his oath as a medical professional and so called man of science.

  8. Err on side of caution?
    The probability that a strain of covid will be extremely deadly to the vaccinated is extremely low. Even if it was, what are you gonna do?
    It’s 2 years now. The time has come to charge through it.

    • You have zero clue to the risks involved and one should considering history err on the side of the precautionary principle and if you don’t personally like[tm] the way things have been handled just look at the private sector agency.

      • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

        Yeah Well if the Govie isn’t going to err on the side of caution by closing the international borders why the fk should we (the public) be expected to err on the side of caution with lockdowns, mandates and segregations.

      • I think you need to google precautionary principle.
        You are referring to the panic principle.

        • I think you misconstrue corporate media playing both sides of the coin for profit and control of the social narrative. Again I recommend Taleb et al on this subject and the failures to date.

  9. Muttafukaburrasaurus.MEMBER

    Has there been any instance of a person testing PCR negative to CV19 after having a confirmed Omicron infection?
    Seems a bit early to make a case either way.

    • That’s a scary thought.
      What could it do if it hangs around like HIV does….
      This thing probably mutated inside someone with HIV…

  10. The timing of this couldn’t be worse for Australia……….whatever the virulence of Omicron this is the end of our innocence with the actions of the LNP in NSW and Canberra to continue with the 3 day quarantines at this time. It looks very contagious and surgical masks won’t stop it. By the time they react it will be too late just as they want. The are clear signs that the Qld Premier has lost the will to stop the cars coming over the border on 17th December which is us in Qld done and leaving only WA applying common sense. She has fallen into the vaccine will stop it trap fully.

    https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/status/1465659957546782725

    Our schools are practically defenceless and the LNP are determined to spread the virus to the population through the schools just like the Tories have in England. We should expect similar outcomes here in a few months as the UK have and if it is virulent our hospitals are full already.

    https://twitter.com/chrischirp/status/1465690083609042946

    • Of course. But they had to accept the “vaccine folly” that you state. Politically they were put under severe pressure. Many QLD people were starting to wonder why they were locked up, because “vaccines work”. The media, federal and NSW government played this narrative with a simple message: NSW will be free before they are. In the end the weakness here is the people themselves, the voters and their inability to put all the facts together listening to emotional soundbites. They made out like NSW was more progressive, moving forward to the future and WA/QLD were “living in a cave” when really it was spin to cover their complete failure.

      They spun a failure (COVID getting in) into a progressive success story and people lapped it up – I can only admire the Liberal and Media PR departments.

      The people in charge knew this, and made sure to white ant WA and QLD from within. If you can’t get the premiers to change their mind from the top because they know the risks of opening up to their communities and economies, change the voters minds from the bottom. All the media and governments in press conferences are stating that we have to “live with COVID and variants” because “vaccines deal with variants” when the reason we don’t want variants is because of vaccine escape. No one is calling them out for obvious logical fallacies, people still believe them.

      Simple messages work, even if untrue mostly. Politics and power trumps everything.

  11. Meanwhile, anyone who attended the following western Sydney and NSW Central Coast venues is considered a casual contact.

    This means they must immediately get tested for coronavirus and isolate until a negative result is received:

    Coles Top Ryde last Friday from 9.30am to 10.45am AEDT;
    Target at Parramatta Westfield from 10.45am to 11am, H&M in the same shopping centre from 11am to 11.15am, the Athlete’s Foot, too, from 11.15am to 11.30am, JD Sports from 11.15am to 12pm, and Rebel Sport from noon to 12.45pm;
    North Wyong IGA on Friday from 6.15pm to 7pm;
    Wyong Pizza Hut on Friday from 7pm to 7.15pm;
    North Wyong KFC on Friday from 7.15pm to 7.30pm;
    Wadalba Woolworths on Friday from 7.30pm to 8.15pm; and
    Toukley Aldi last Saturday from 4.45pm to 5.45pm.

    Well we are about to find out how contagious this will be in heavily vaccinated NSW.
    Contagiousness of omicron is a product of two unknowns
    2. The intrinsic R0 of the virus
    2. The degree of immune escape – in a heavily vaccinate population, this is the more important factor.

        • SoMPLSBoyMEMBER

          Haha!
          Adidas deluxe double stripe trackie dax and fresh black Superstar 3 stripers for the feet.
          Never over or underdressed and the ideal suit for the court mention!

      • Mike Herman TroutMEMBER

        Very heavy on the food courts most likely…. food courts been getting a bum rap on here these days…..

        • Yes. Its extremely odd.

          This disease goes after the obese like nothing I have ever seen.

          Coronary disease is linked strongly with central obesity. Despite this, some some thin people are unlucky and get struck down with coronary disease. Being thin confers a degree of protection, but it is partial.

          With Covid, bad outcomes are extremely tied to obesity. Far more than any other infectious disease.

          https://www.bmj.com/content/372/bmj.n623

          Covid-19 death rates are 10 times higher in countries where more than half of the adult population is classified as overweight, a comprehensive report from the World Obesity Federation has found.

          The report analysed mortality data from Johns Hopkins University and the WHO Global Health Observatory data on obesity.1 Of the 2.5 million covid-19 deaths reported by the end of February 2021, 2.2 million were in countries where over half the population is classified as overweight—defined as a body mass index above 25.

          Taking data from over 160 countries, the report found linear correlations between a country’s covid-19 mortality and the proportion of adults that are overweight. There is not a single example of a country with less than 40% of the population overweight that has high death rates (over 10 per 100 000), the report said. Similarly, no country with a death rate over 100 per 100 000 had less than 50% of their population overweight.

          • Frank DrebinMEMBER

            Dunno, there are a lot of fat “little Emperors” getting around Beijing and Shanghai courtesy of Westenr treats like KFC and Maccas !!.

          • It is isn’t it. Western obesity and western population pyramids.

            Well guess they must have been researching something. They sure didn’t research any useful therapeutics or vaccines.

        • Basically, fat peoples bodies eat the protecting antibodies the same way they will smash a family Macca’s meal. LOL

          “SARS-CoV-2 infection induces neutralizing antibodies in all lean but only in few obese COVID-19 patients. SARS-CoV-2 infection also induces anti-MDA and anti-AD autoimmune antibodies more in lean than in obese patients as compared to uninfected controls.”

          • kiwikarynMEMBER

            Obesity causes a high level of chronic inflammation, which compromises the immune system. The dirty little secret that they don’t want you to know is that vaccines dont work very well on the obese either. For the same reason. Any fatties out there better start trying to figure out how they can get their booster shots monthly.

          • Just another reason I’ve never been fat in my entire life. EVER! and I refuse to let myself be that way.

  12. Just understand that initial European and Australian cases are going to be double vaccinated relatively healthy and relatively young people. That data tells you NOTHING about how it will behave with local community spread.

  13. BaldbadgerMEMBER

    Come on. It’s not too hard. Wait for more data (especially hospitalisation rates in the coming weeks). In the mean time prepare for the worst and hope for the best. Something we should have been doing long ago.

    • The Traveling Wilbur 🙉🙈🙊

      Oh come on. When was the last time that prudence and commonsense even got a look in around here. Or Federally.

      Tell him he’s dreamin’…

      Edit: much better to just yell at each other in an echo chamber and waste electrons over what’s going to / not going to happen with zero available evidence to backup any speculation. Oops, I think I hear the dinner-bell, have to go, and make more posts.

      • “commonsense” oh you mean environmental basis … wellie they are – all – using whatever gifted or consumed basis and knowledge is only applicable if it just so happens to conform to the prior …

        PS. better yet since covid landed how has the -its nothingburger – played out, how many have been relegated to some insane “you deserved it” meme aka old, fat, unfit, or not chosen by some higher power to live on … e.g. the virtuous will live on …

    • I will wager a $100 that the consequence will be the same. Old vulnerable people and younger co-morbid folks will be the victims. We will get a few fitness fanatic antivaxxers being made a point of when they die, but they will be the exception not the rule.

      Its really not that hard to understand. Inflammatory and respiratory diseases target the old and sick, always have, always will. Its not killing the Australian swimming team.

  14. I remember reading some expert at the start of the pandemic who said “viruses don’t want to kill their hosts.” They mutate so we can live and they can too. Perhaps we’re there.

  15. Nothing is going to end this pandemic…. COVID-19 has triggered a 20-year mass die-off event that was always going to occur to bring our plague back into check. Population overshoot always results in a reversion to mean/sustainable numbers. The Wuhan Institute Virology lab leak just brought things to a head a bit quicker than might have otherwise been the case.

    The fact that this mass-die off event has coincided with a populist movement to end all fossil fuel consumption is interesting, as the former is necessary to accommodate the later

    • Frank DrebinMEMBER

      Yeah I dunno, the number of people who have died globally from this thing over two years have probably been replaced in a week given current birth rates.

      • yes good point…. which begs the question, will this in turn trigger a series of mass-societal upheaval leading to mass casualties in various geographies…. this appears to be playing out in some locations. More to come no doubt

  16. Is this correct? (former Deputy Chief Health Officer Nick Coatesworth as per article.
    Quote:
    “If this is milder than delta, you actually want it to spread as quickly as possible. You want it to out-compete delta and become the predominant circulating virus.“
    -/-
    The information so far is that this is a new variant with considerable changes in the unstable man made covid-19 virus – particularly in the Fauci~Daszak~Wuhan spike that the vaccines (or antibodies if previously infected with covid-19) are mapped to / so it just may be potentially vaccine and ‘prior covid-19 infection antibody’ resistant.

    A new variant supposedly incubated & mutated in an health & hiv compromised African cohort.

    This Covid-19 virus overall is basically the archaic human cold (corana) virus with a lab forced (Daszak, Fauci, Wuhan Labs 2014 Obama Biden era NIH EcoHealth Alliance grant) in gain of function with the inclusion of an ACE2 spike.
    To now penetrate & burst human ACE2 lung cells, to enter the human blood stream & to liquify the blood vessels to cause stroke & organ damage.
    A holy grail of virus BioWarfare experimentation for at least 2 decades. A highly infectious benign carrier virus with man made adaption to targeted human lethality.

    ACE2 cells in humans vary by age, racial group & gender.
    And given the mutations it is possible it now likely attacks ‘new & different’ human ACE2 groups.
    Different age groups, different gender and racial group propensity in being infected & lethal.

    And also isn’t this variant an ADDITIONAL virus to the existing Indian delta strain?
    If there is no residual immunity from the Delta strain as well as the vaccines inhibiting the Delta strain.
    Then being infected or vaccinated from the delta and previous variants may not protect you from being infected with the other.
    So possibly you can catch both variants.

    Opinions?

  17. Would it be possible for McDonalds to fry all their food in mRNA and thereby vaccinate the obese without jabbing?