Weekend Reading 23-24 May 2020

Global Macro / Markets / Investing:





Leith van Onselen


      • I haven’t done a good ghost first in a while… but that’s not how I do them… 😉

        Congrats btw

          • boomengineeringMEMBER

            Last arm story.
            Even more half dead people at hospital than the mall and that’s something. Seemed like an abattoir , sheep in one end, cut up and drugged out the other.
            Poor guy in the other bed couldn’t get to sleep as the roof sheet vibrating in the heavy wind like a rusty harmonica’s many non harmonious intermittent scale attempts. The Doc/ Pharmacist came in and rattled off about 10 different medications for him. He had a enlarged prostrate scraped out and 3 days later his testicle was twice the size.
            Quite a big team just to drill a hole and screw into a bit of my bone, 2 1/2 hours,
            A modified Henry’s approach to radial tuberosity identifying and protecting the lateral cutaneous nerve of the forearm. The retracted biceps tendon was identified through a more proximal incision, mobilized and prepared . An 8mm tunnel was prepared in the radial tuberosity.
            A looped FibreWire suture was used to create a whip stitch in the tendon. The tendon was passed into the tunnel and held with a biceps button and 7mm BioComposite biceps tenodesis (Arthrex) screw with a tension slide technique.
            The drug pushers came out of the woodwork like flies imposing their drug beliefs onto me.” No I don’t want pain killers it doesn’t hurt”. In any case wouldn’t take them anyhow as pain is good, it keeps you from overstepping the mark.
            Came home from hospital changed into work clothes and went to pick up some German Food Company’s stainless steel jobs.
            Ditched the sling already as the new black ones with steel rings ( the first doctor couldn’t figure out how to use the previous one} are horribly uncomfortable. Why did the change from the old table cloth type?

          • boomengineeringMEMBER

            Btw, am nursing it and careful.
            Would have loved to look at the procedure while it was carried out but no way that could happen.
            Both arms were bandaged as the nurse tried to take the cannula out the same way it went in blowing up the vein etc, wonder what the big German new client thought as a walking wounded came to save him from his jobs.

    • LoL. That article about offset vs. redraw doesn’t even mention the most important difference (at least, for non-retirees who are either investors or thinking of renting out their PPOR in the future) which is tax implications. Admittedly, the first sentence starts with the word “Retirees..”. But, the author should have been more explicit about the fact that the advice really applies only to retirees and misses the main point for everyone else.

    • working class hamMEMBER

      3.5m on JK not 6.5m? Kinda scary that the numbers are that wrong.
      Should be good for the unemployment figure, once it finishes. Still be in the low teens at the moment.

    • Mining BoganMEMBER

      The MSM is selling it as an opportunity.

      By the time insiders finishes on sunday morning it will be a stroke of economic genius by the adults.

    • The new figure of 80bn is still a LOT of money, and should provide adequate stimulus even for such a big economic downturn as this. If the original figure of 130bn had been correct, Australia would have been providing more stimulus per capita than any other country (i.e. more than UK, Italy, Spain, etc. with more severe lockdowns).

      • Jumping jack flash

        It sounds like a lot of money but it is still less than the total yearly interest obligation on our mortgage debt pile. Just the interest. Each and every year. For the next 30 years, give or take.

      • Jumping jack flash

        The rich are best to give money to. They know what to do with it because they have a lot. No use giving it to the poor they have no idea. They’re poor for a reason you know.

      • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

        Yup – the Meritocracy turns everybody into their own slave master, whipping themselves without mercy to get ahead.

        Of course the foundations of the Meritocracy demand us to believe that all population groups are equally capable, and blessed with exactly the same physical and mental capabilities, found in exactly the same frequencies…. that is why those at the top are so keen to deny that there is any biological or cultural basis for their success.


        Under the meritocracy all success comes through hard work, as opposed to innate ability.


        • Repeating myself here … Meritocracy was a sarcastic term coined by its original author, hence anyone using it outside that context suffers a categorical error at onset – which then filters through their entire premise.

          • Dunlop’s original use of the term was adopted and co-opted . Language and its meaning changes over time. Nothing to do with fatal flaws flowing through an argument.

          • drsmithyMEMBER

            Under the Meritocracy, if you are successful it is because you have merit, and if you are a failure it is because you do not.

          • I suggest both above familiarize themselves with what the original author was talking about and their used of the term in reference to it.

            Smithy you would be surprised to know your not totally out of context, but don’t seem to understand or aware of how it plays out.

            Olaf same for you as this is not so much a change in meaning, but some people perceptions about it in its application too society.

        • Um no

          Promoting / whatever on merit is on capability whether from hardwork , innate ability or both

          Swingeing around looking for outrage

        • Jumping jack flash

          Agree completely. These days “innate ability” is a dirty word and probably racist and/or oppressive.

          University standards continue to drop so everyone can be whatever they want to be and nothing works well anymore.

          • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

            Once Uni degrees are worthless, once they’re handed out to maintain ‘diversity’ as opposed to record achievement, once they no longer work as a Corporate filter, watch companies bring back IQ tests as a part of their selection process (of course they won’t be called IQ tests, but they will be).

            Frankly everyone will be better off – companies will get capable workers and workers will be able to avoid costly years at University that are designed to act as a filter.

      • DominicMEMBER

        Piketty is a special ⎌brand of idiot. Can’t believe the MSM gave him so much oxygen. Oh well, that’s what ignorance does I guess.

    • hence why we don’t see inflation. Elites worked this out and are not better plumbers than Ermo. No great amount of money leaks to the masses. Just enough to keep the on a leash.

    • Jim's Central Banking

      Of course!

      I wish most of the armed militiamen weren’t clueless conspiratards unable to comprehend the actual war being waged against them.

      • Once enough plebs cotton on as. To what’s happened here (again) and see that all that money printing / QE and lower teh rates has again bailed out the big end, whilst they go broke or struggle on through this after all the sacrifices the poorest have made. I sense there will be rioting and protests like occupy wall street.

        If it changes anything though, I’m not sure.

    • DominicMEMBER

      Great idea! Presumably they would sell it to a country that didn’t have any coronavirus losses.

      Oh wait …

      • They’ve even got a place to hang it already!
        “Who needs Paris? Chinese copycat culture strikes again with Louvre”

        • They would probably be more interested in buying the building rather than the painting.

          The Chinese, including HKers, typically only get 1 or 2 weeks annual leave so when they go on their international trips they are in a rush to cram as much in as possible. One HK couple I know were telling me about a European tour they had gone on – something like 10 countries in 10 days. I asked how the [email protected] did they have time to see anything. They replied no it was okay, for instance in Paris they went to the Louvre. Yeah, did they see the Mona Lisa? Oh no, we didn’t go inside, the bus just stopped so we could take photos with the pyramid in the background.

          • darklydrawlMEMBER

            You see this a lot in Oz too. Bus loads of Asian tourists just get out at the major stops – take a selfie / group photo in front of the attraction (or often just the sign marking the attraction) and get back on the bus – it’s like ticking off a list. Most of them sleep between stops too!! I find it a strange and pointless way to travel as a tourist, but lots of them do it that way. Different strokes I guess.

          • @darklydrawl As long as they can share the pic on FB or Instagram that is enough to impress their friends with their travels. Neither they, nor their friends, have any actual interest in the cultural artefacts inside those galleries.

  1. Ukraine fnMEMBER

    Your starting to sound like I think Gavin and it’s not a good place to be .

    Jobkeeper stuff up, stupid SA Govt no consultation to pubs on reopening, the two points you mention above .

    The so called “Adult’s in charge “ around the world are shown up to be hollow men.

    Billy Joel’s song “We didn’t start the fire” comes to mind.

    • Who are you referring to? If people are starting to sound like me it’s probably because they have caught a healthy dose of cynicism which is more contagious than corona virus, but does far more harm to society. Especially this country with its property only goes up never ending captial gains attitude. 🤣

    • DominicMEMBER

      I think Caitlin Johnston has fought some good battles over the years – but her read on China and its ambitions appears to be off the mark here.

      Suggesting that China ‘doesn’t want to take over the world’ is a false binary. Strategically it has been trying to establish footholds anywhere it can – in the Asia Pacific region, at any rate.

        • DominicMEMBER

          An anti-US, pro-China opinion. What’s an opinion worth if it comes from a source so hopelessly biased?

          I get that “Putin stole the election” is total BS but there is evidence aplenty that China has actively been buying Strayan pollies and influence here and being rather nasty every time they’ve been caught doing it: Racialist!! * yawns *

      • China actually approached Obama about the south china sea issue and he said naw ….

        Why is it when any country takes a defensive stance against the U.S. its always Bernays’ed into anti freedom aggression – MIC funding – ?????

        • DominicMEMBER

          Yes, skip. The Yanks are bullying hypocrites led by the MIC. I get it and don’t disagree that’s the case. However, that fact doesn’t make the Chinese an innocent party. The CCP are a tyrannical, evil bunch whose actions would not be out of place in an Orwellian novel.

          • I don’t imbue nations with tautologous verbiage E.g. China is not a communist state and the party is neither seeking it, albeit it is one party with factions residing in it. The biggest drama for most is the failure to understand one can argue with it, within rules, but, never threaten it.

            China is quite aware of what plans others would have for it if the opportunity presented itself, something it has experienced in the near past. That said I don’t have a iron in the fire either way, but detest building of narratives and simplistic frameworks too support some ideological agenda.

          • The Traveling Wilbur

            They’ve got the Penguin Big Brother play book, and they’re running it play by play.

    • The only thing now that could stop ww3 and billions of people dieing would be if the oceans started to rise and we all realized that we need to work together to stop it. Now how do we get the oceans to start rising?

    • It is a mystery that the US is allied with Australia when so many Aussies hate it irrationally. This one is going to everyone on my e-mail list.

        • DominicMEMBER

          The Fed are like the boy in the dyke, sticking his fingers in every leak that is sprung – the more he plugs the holes the more leaks break out.

          The Fed will end up buying everything in the end. None of this is a solution – it is simply delaying the start of an inevitable reset.

    • Who were the billionaires telling them it was just a flu?

      Donald Trump and elon musk ?

      All the other billionaires told them it was the end of the world and banned any discussion that might suggest otherwise

      • Ronin8317MEMBER

        Jeff Bezos got 24 billions richer in one month. It is not ‘just as flu’, it is a great opportunity for the government to give money to the rich while the population is distracted.

        • Correct. All this financial aid has helped nobody except the already exceedingly wealthy. And I still haven’t seen my UBI. Pricks.

          • Not yet, applied for 3 more roles this week. Waiting to receive feedback. 2 of them were part time roles. Which would suit me fine. I want to ideally work 3 days and have 2 spare to hussle for side gigs or similar.

            A friend of mine picked up a third gen prelude this week. I’m gonna help him get it running, do basic service and detail and see if we can flip it for a profit. My sister also has a Suzuki Jimny that needs a little love, I reckon I can fix a few items (suspension and brakes) get it re-rego’d and flip it also for a small profit.

            That should keep the lights on for a bit if it pans out.

            Also spent Friday afternoon preparing the backyard for some planter boxes. So thankfully not wasting time. 🙂

          • @Gav, Well chosen salvage cars were lucrative early mid 90’s. Often just a panel or basic stuff, a weekend with a mate & on the market for $600-$1k profit back then. We went for Lasers or things that we knew we could sell easily. Not allowed in NSW now as far as I now, but might be a good supply if they’re allowed to be brought back from the dead in Vic?

          • Thanks Ickers we tested electrics yesterday and it looks like brake switch is stuffed. Brakes stay on. But everything else (except electric antenna works).

  2. reusachtigeMEMBER

    I think everyone is starting to realise that things are going back to normal. Stocks booming. Housing booming. Good times ahead for sure. Now’s a great time to be at an auction gearing up for the new boom. It will be tremendous. Now I’m off for a champers brunch with friends in Bondi !!

    • Yeah what someone else pointed out here was a beauty, so the stimulus has been 12% of GDP, not 25% as claimed by Govt… and we know the size matters when it comes to depression evading stimulus.

    • Waiting for the Treasury to pick up on their accounting error – to finally realise immigration is actually a deficit to Australia.

  3. migtronixMEMBER

    “Australia’s two-way trade with China represents 26 per cent of our total trade with the world. Last financial year, that relationship was worth $235 billion, which almost equalled the combined value of our two-way trade with Japan ($88.5 billion), the United States ($76.4 billion), South Korea ($41.4 billion) and Singapore ($32.7 billion), our trading partners ranked second to fifth.

    Our two-way trade in goods and services with the Chinese has been in surplus since the global financial crisis of 2008-9, and for many decades more with the Japanese. With the Americans, we have always been in deficit. Last financial year, the surplus with China was $71.4 billion, and with Japan it was $34.9 billion. The deficit with the US was $26.9 billion.”


    • reusachtigeMEMBER

      Yep. Right here is the reason why we need to do Chinas bidding not Americas. China gives us great profits. America gives us great losses. It’s plain as day to see. I hope our leaders see sense and p1ss the Americans off in favour of the way more important Chinamen!!

    • Not too long ago George M was one of the more thoughtful commentators around. Not now.
      I wonder when he drank the koolade and much $$$$ it represented for him to become a such a thoughtless stooge.

    • DingwallMEMBER

      When you are a country that seems to despise manufacturing anything of quality or even quantity to supply internally or to the world, you end up with that sort of trade balance. We also don’t do innovation unless it’s a new lamp stand for the house market. The US doesn’t need our dirt …..
      We have painted ourselves into a corner…. the only way out is for someone to spill the barrel of turps with us in the corner.

    • Iron and coal are finite, eventually someone’s going to buy the sh!t, and eventually China can no longer use it to build their navy, cos no one trusts the dog eaters, they don’t honour international agreements, they bribe cheap nations, they puke propaganda.
      And the best defence the K.Rudd cheer squad can come up with is, “hey, but look at the US”

    • A list of possibly the most boring cars of all time, and majority are Japanese. 🤣

      • Arthur Schopenhauer

        I looked into converting our Jazz to an electric drive train, but it isn’t strong enough to carry a decent load of batteries. Volvo 1800, old Land Rover or VW Type 3 station wagon are better candidates.
        When you add it all up, it’s cheaper to buy a Leaf or Kona electric. (But a lot less fun.)

  4. Has anyone else noticed the incredibly “woke” – and in my opinion deeply offensive – comments by the RBA at the bottom of their speeches?

    I went back and had a look and since June 2019 the RBA has acknowledged Aboriginals and Tory Straits Islanders as the traditional custodians of Australia.

    So I guess all of you who’re not aboriginals or Tory straits islanders, in the RBA’s opinion, are simply squatters.

    Yet another reason to Loathe Lowe…

    • Untersberg Mountain

      I appreciate the opinions differ on this subject, but for me, recognition of Indigenous people is something we don’t do enough of.

      If you want really sickening ‘woke’, you really cannot go past the DomainFax/ABC Politburu telling us that we should be grateful that ‘New Australians’ from a certain country have decided to grace us with their presence in large numbers, predominantly single males, and then meticulously censoring any reporting of their inolvement in crime or their appalling attitudes towards women.

    • Nah Peter. It’s just good manners. Being respectful to the traditional landholders. We do it in schools and at sporting events too. The Western Sydney Wanderers had an aboriginal smoking ceremony on the pitch at the start of the session. You would have had a fit! It costs little and makes us better people. But you prove yourself a sh!t if you like.

      • DominicMEMBER

        In sentiment it’s not a bad thing, but it smacks of tokenism because, at the end end the day it’s little more than a way of saying: we won’t and can’t compensate you for the past but we’ll speak some empty words – There, there, run along now.

      • Whenever I hear suck acknowledgements, it sounds like ‘now that we’ve got that ab0 stuff out of the way, now onto the important stuff…..’

    • I bet the Mabo decision of the High Court in 1992 didn’t sit well with you, Peter. My 10 year old was doing a short essay on it for Year 5 school, yesterday. I will ask her if she is prepared to apologise to you for being “woke”. I’ll get her so do one on the White Australia Policy from the 1950s to cheer you up.

      • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

        Cool idea – ask her what she thinks Australia would look like if we weren’t so discriminating back then?

        Maybe she could start with another Southern Hemisphere nation, like Argentina or South Africa? Such great places to live, not at all stratified along ethnic lines at all….

        Won’t matter, we’re in the process of catching up to them very shortly.

        • That’s true Stewie, the place is turning into a dump with our immigration madness. But paying some respect to aboriginal people is not “woke”. It’s the right thing to do, or maybe I just listened to too much Midnight Oil in my yoof (analysing Beds Are Burning was another one of her recent school projects!).

          • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

            I honestly don’t have an issue with acknowledging the Aboriginal people, we have multiple days already celebrating them:

            1. 13th Feb – Anniversary of National Apology Day
            2. 19th Mar – National Close the Gap Day
            3. 26th May – National Sorry Day
            4. 27th May – 1967 Referendum celebrations
            5. 27th May to 3rd of June – a whole Week of National Reconicilation
            6. 3rd June – Mabo Day
            7. 5th to 12th July – a whole Week of NAIDOC celebrations
            8. 4th August – National Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Children’s Day
            9. 2nd Sep – Indigenous Literacy Day
            10. 13th Sep – Anniversary of the UN Declaration on the rights of Indigenous People.

            But if we are really going to preface every public utterance with some forelock tugging towards our Indigenous, why stop there? In fairness shouldn’t we also be honoring Colonial Australians who…. well built and founded Australia?

          • BigDuke6MEMBER

            Its becoming sadly obvious that Aboriginal native title may be the only thing that stops us selling off everything to foreign interests especially China. Think on it.

    • happy valleyMEMBER

      Happy clappy and therefore a worry. The RBA happy clappies have screwed savers and depositors in to the ground and have enjoyed every moment of it.

      • DominicMEMBER

        Yes, ‘everyone’s doing it’, although what connection an institution, whose primary aim is to spew out billions in fake money, has with the traditional land I don’t know.

    • @Cristian, I’ve no problem with showing respect to indigenous people or their culture. What I do have a problem with is these vapid throw away statements that every corporate mouth breather these days uses to make themselves feel good, while actually doing nothing.

      For example my friend works at a University and showed me an email signature from HR person that has this statement about acknowledging the land that the University’s are built on being that of the original elders etc.. so does that mean the University is paying land tax back to them as a form of respect?

      What exactly does putting the statement in an email signature do? Except give the person doing it a smug warm feeling?

      In my opinion actions speak louder than throw away words or email signatures or even words on the wall of target checkout (I saw it at Eastland and wanted to puke). Since when do corporations actually give 2 shytes about anything other than profit?

      For me showing respect to our native people is done via respecting the land itself. By not raping it or pillaging it for the next urban centre, by leaving trees that have been growing for hundreds of years, but preserving the pristine waterways (think of the damage done to the Murray Darling Basin) etc.. but we are too busy chopping up the land to make it work for profit.

      If all these office workers want to do some good. I’d suggest they go out and work in these remote communities and volunteer their time, but also donate to orgs that do. Not shove this empty wording into an email signature. Or happy clappy announce it at the start of some corporate or sporting event. I just roll my eyes when I see it.

      • Spot on. It usually seems like rich people in expensive suits spouting pointless platitudes to make the speaker and possibly the audience feel virtuous without actually achieving anything beyond emitting a bunch of flatus that is immediately forgotten.

        Words and symbols are very important, but actions speak louder than words.

      • haroldusMEMBER

        At universities HR would have a standard email signature that all staff have to use.

        • My friend has told me that certain view points are forcefully pushed across at specific Universities (cough Clayton Monash haha). And that any deviation or difference of opinion is treated as insubordination. So basically you have to remain quiet if you don’t agree with their overarching stance on issues. I get to mock him because I used to work for a company where it was a similar experience for me, but now I’ve left I’m free to have whatever opinions I like.

          The things we put up with for money eh?

      • Yeaaahh. You’ve pretty much nailed the feeling when that script gets read. It’s like, aborigines are being used as a way to borrow credibility in being “society conscious”.. you know, supposed to make us feel that the ivory towers they reside in arent that high.

      • Ukraine fnMEMBER

        @Gavin . I have worked in two remote communities and can say from experience that we as a nation have big problems.
        Basically in my opinion gained from years of experience in these communities is that their is nothing that we can do as a nation that will satisfy our first nations people in regards to reconciliation and reparations . Our cultures clash too much and we are looked upon as owing a debt that can’t be repaid no matter what we do.
        IMO a line needs to be drawn in the sand ,acknowledge mistakes and move forward hand in hand with mutual respect of each others culture and it’s differences .
        No use being apologetic if in no way it is going to be accepted.

      • TrooDohMEMBER

        I wonder if such acknowledgements will catch on in other countries. After all, every other country on earth has at some point changed hands and experienced migrations and invasions.

        For instance, how about special ceremonies in England acknowledging the traditional Celtic owners of the land?

      • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

        Most likely they are our second people – they wiped out the first people around 4,000 years ago when technologically advanced tribes from PNG with advanced ‘sticks’ moved in outward expansion into both the Pacific Islands and into Australia.

        Expansion into the Pacific:

        Complete cultural language replacement in Australia

        Ironically the only true genocide committed in Australia most likely occured 4,000 years ago, which was so complete that by the time Colonial Australians arrived barely a single word from the true first peoples of Australia still existed.

        I think if the UN is going to deny Europeans the right to be seen as the first people of Europe due to the Aryan invasion by the Corded ware cultures (they use to be called the Battle Axe culture, but apparently that risked too many of the wrong types becoming interested in the subject) around 4,000 years ago, then the same standards should apply to Australia.

        • I have no objection to acknowledging the unique role played by the Aboriginal People’s – and I totally understand that our ancestors treated them very badly.

          What I have a problem with is the RBA’s implications that we don’t have property rights and their virtue signalling.

          This is not an appropriate venue for this sort of thing, nor is it appropriately worded. The RBA are servants of all Australians. Maybe they’ve forgotten that?

          • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

            I think Ronin8317 said it best “It is a merely a fake fashion statement.”

    • Jim's Central Banking

      The RBA has done an entire generation out of housing so maybe we are just squatters. In which case we should start treating this society with the contempt it shows us.

    • Rorke's DriftMEMBER

      Peter I wasnt aware of the woke stuff from the RBA. Its ok to acknowledge traditional custodian, but not appropriate from RBA given their role.
      My view is that too much of this traditionsl acknowledgement is damaging to our society. It reinforces a separateness of different groups and is used to disconnect and delegitimise Australians connection to the country. Its a key part of weakening Australia and breaking down our society to an economic zone only,
      What bugs me is that having reinforced their separateness from other Australian, that they’re special, they dont respect others culture. I’ve been deeply offended when an indigenous person stood up at the Sydney Cricket Ground before a test match, one of our cultures most sacred places where all Australians can gather in freedom, and tell us we are only guests in his land! If I dont belong at the SCG Sydney test match, where do I? He made it clear to me that day that they dont want reconciliation, thats political bullshit and that I have to speak up and defend my society if I dont want it torn apart long term.

  5. Woohoo. Tiny Tim tomato seeds in the post. Now to wait 3 – 14 days for Auspost delayed delivery…

    • happy valleyMEMBER

      Easy to cover that reprieve – just r.pe savers and depositors again to pay for it? Can’t have a bank’s NIM shaved any further or have senior management take a very serious pay cut?

        • happy valleyMEMBER

          Absolutely correct – excess franking credit “refund” zero taxpayers’ sh.t does not stink and they are a protected species for SFM. We can’t see John Howard’s greatest ever gift that keeps on giving rort brought to an end. Rankings in a bank’s pecking order are: 1. senior management; 2. shareholders; 3. borrowers; and 4. a long last and the perpetual screw target, savers and retail depositors. Ably assisted by the RBA happy clappies and their cash rate tool, which is not even the basis for a bank’s funding – the RBA happy clappies and the private banksters have been perpetuating this ruse for years.

    • oh to humanity! “I have to PAY BACK what I borrowed”…
      The 69-year-old and his partner have bought two properties — one in Brisbane, the other in Perth — in the past 10 years to help fund their retirement.
      But the value of the Brisbane property has flatlined and the Perth property, a unit in the city’s outer suburbs, has plummeted from $425,000 in 2016 to $300,000 today, according to a recent valuation.
      “The intent was … to provide us with some equity growth in the properties, which would then assist us in the future once I had retired,” Mr Green said.

      So selling to the next generation at a higher price for no other reason than you signed on a piece of paper with a bank was their idea of a retirement plan?
      No, why dont you pay for your own a$$ and work till you have to in order to support yourself.

      • My guess is that Westpac is behind these articles. A little pantomime using one of their stooge MPs.

        I think the subtext is that Westpac is really worried and in a lot of trouble given their epic exposure to IO loans. They must be rolled over to prevent a collapse and destruction of their balance sheet.

        Note the call at the end for extending IO loans to become industry wide to help the ‘battlers’ and keep Westpac alive…

      • WTF? losing money on heavily geared property speculation? Might have to sell at a loss? WTF? That’s unpossible!! The government needs to bail these speculators out immediately!

    • Banana ManMEMBER

      poor bloke
      “Investors are ‘not fat cats’

      Sydney investor Mike Scotland, a former school teacher, owes $1.1 million to the banks and is in a similar predicament.

      Mr Scotland has six investment properties and all the loans have switched to principal and interest.”

    • TailorTrashMEMBER

      Westpac must be breathing a sigh of relief ….
      They get to hide their massive subprime loan book for another year …these people can’t pay back what they borrowed …never could …never will

      • arthritic kneeMEMBER

        That’s the problem with having 40% plus of your book IO. When they get into trouble you can’t offer to downshift them to IO as they already there. So you move to payment ‘holidays’ and these 60 yr olds getting less time to pay off the actual money owed and still ain’t got no job. We may be moving to a time where misery doubles every seven years.

  6. I thought some might be interested that the owner of this website is threatening me (with something) for producing “propaganda”

    This consisted of me pointing out that his own data shows that peak concern about coronavirus among Australians had peaked a long time ago and been falling ever since

    I don’t know how to link comments but it’s about half way down

    May 22, 2020 at 12:03 pm
    So people are becoming less and less concerned?

    Seems like peak concern was 13 April


    David Llewellyn-SmithMEMBER
    May 23, 2020 at 6:41 am
    Last warning, Coming. Stop the virus propaganda or you will be banned.


    I thought it was concerning that the free exchange of ideas and discussion was being threatened, due to me providing a fairly indisputable interpretation of his own data

    Perhaps there are some others here who feel the same way

    • I am GrootMEMBER

      Compared to most others, this site is pretty permissive when it comes to what they allow people to post. To be fair, unlike Doc X, you have backed off the virus thing a bit lately.

      But you had a good run at putting forward your opinions quite stridently well before anyone was in a position to truly know much about the virus and how it would all play out. I don’t think you’ve got too much to complain about.

      • Well said. Big difference between being able to put your point of view forward and being allowed to run a one man propaganda effort.

      • I presented data and mathematics in the face of hysterical agitation

        I think that would be the opposite of propaganda

        And all of it proven entirely correct , when everyone here believed the mortality would be 10%

        And actually I was in a position to make them because this was legitimate data was published in first rate medical journals

        You know actual real evidence

        • A bit of self-delusion there I think. There is plenty of data and mathematics out there on the pandemic, and from reputable sources. Most of us here look to genuine expert opinion, such as the leading epidemiologists, virologists, and health authorities. I may have missed it, but I don’t think you have any formal qualifications on the subject, is that right? I don’t come here to read endless posts by non experts which seem constructed to support a predetermined position. Hence my support for DLS’ editorial position. Nothing personal, that view applies across the board.

          • I (and doctor x) have posted so many actual scientific articles about this (Linking to actual medical journals) , that I am completely baffled by your statement

            Everyone else was linking to medium.com and worldometer

            Do you actually remember what it was like here?
            People were claiming the mortality was 10% and hundreds of thousands of Australians were going to die ?
            I was literally the only person refuting it

            Has everyone just blocked this from their memories ?

          • Look at the feedback you’re getting from everyone here. Take it on board. Your posts here often have value but they were poor on the topic of the virus.

          • I think I got plenty of positive feedback about the virus stuff from many people on this site (migtronix, doctor x, Arthur, Boom engineering, Stewie etc) and I’ve changed a lot of minds
            And I was objectively proven correct

            So I’m happy with it

            Some people can’t have their minds changed

          • You said you were a doctor, all your credibility was lost since then for me, but your still not as bad as Skippy

        • BigDuke6MEMBER

          I lurked for 12 months and joined 4 months ago.
          I’ve been disappointed in the quality of comment and thinking on this site.
          The mods seem to want it that way.
          I got modded on posting a link to a reputable newspaper just not from this country.
          They really just want the comments to be all little updates on peoples gardens, immigration and what people are drinking that night.
          I wont be renewing my membership at this rate.

          • I believe you’re a medical doctor as well ?

            Somehow we are the ones who are not entitled to an opinion on a matter we are actually qualified to discuss

          • BigDuke6MEMBER

            Yes. So we’re the ones who should have been in panic!
            I’m sure you are the same but I’m used to saying to people when I panic then its time to panic. I deal with scared people every day and sift through risk. Risk was not there to any significance, with Covid. Your comment about how over 70’s or with health conditions should have been isolated and the world carried on was correct for mine. People should have agreed not called you out. If the average age of death in Italy was over 80 then here it must be over 90. Hit them with that stat if you are allowed to know.
            I think the thinkers here have eventually got there by talking about we deal with death badly etc. All you can do is lead the people to water, if they dont drink then screwem.

          • Yeah, I think a major part of the problem is that people with no medical background have no experience with death, or only very limited and highly emotionally charged experience

            Even though they were seeing the data and not able to refute it logically in any way, their minds just could not accept the fact that we would allow any miniscule increase in risk (even though they and we do that every day)

          • BigDuke6MEMBER

            The amusing part is that is you’ve been insulted by many with probably no more than a TAFE diploma education level.
            People have no idea of the training and discipline of medicine. When we go to parties and someone (who no doubt likes to give themselves a username of “doc” on sites like this) pipes up that they wanted to be a doctor but didn’t … you can watch my wifes hackles rise… she knows the sacrifice and hard times that are coming with it.
            The way you have spent so much time with your posts has been admirable. I’ve given up. Gold and lead only from now.

          • FWIW I read most articles and comments list daily and didn’t see anything that I’d have a problem with – from either side of the coronavirus debate. We were always dealing with an unknown, but with some of us and some experts having better access to data than the norm. That’s the exact kind of situation where you’d expect a range of opinions, and them having to “duke it out” somewhat. And for once perhaps on a topic that isn’t overly political (in a partisan way) unless we make it one.
            All matters involving risk are such that they invite an open set of responses without right or wrong.
            I once heard a story of a man that was paranoid about car accidents and wore a helmet every time he drove in a car. People thought he was ridiculous. Anyway about 10 years in to his bizarre habit he had a major accident (caused by another driver) that by rights should have killed him. He survived thanks to his helmet.
            His approach to risk was ‘insane’ and he lived when he otherwise would have died.
            On the other hand people that free-climb up cliff faces, while wife and kids are at home, to me sounds equally insane.
            Due to the extreme position taken by the mass media on issues of immigration and race, particularly their complete denial of any right to racial interests for Anglo-Saxons/Celts, boards like this must always be at risk of cutting a very bizarre (and to some dangerous) image to outside observers, perhaps similarly with coronavirus. So I am just respectful of all that post, and thankful, and also thankful of the owners for allowing fairly free flowing discussion and providing the information and platform that they do.
            No criticism of anybody or any side here, I get seriously aggrieved when I think fair statements of mine get censored or rebuked anywhere. It’s a delicate balance all we can all do is push on as we think best. The challenge for people who are right on an issue, is that it will only generally be accepted well after the fact 😉

          • you’ve been insulted by many with probably no more than a TAFE diploma education level

            Jesus! ego much. I’m sure you’ve been told your whole life how awesome you are for achieving high grades at school, and overheard your mother on many occasions bragging to people about your superiority. But, have a little humility. Next you’ll be calling everyone deplorables because they don’t agree with you.

            Fun fact: over half of the domestic medical students going through my local University have a solid history of mental illness before they even begin practising.

          • BigDuke6MEMBER

            Ok well maybe that line was an attempt to wind people up and start a fight. Somewhere on this thread someone says we dont want it like ZH. Why not? On ZH you just scan through the one line prepper posts until you find good thinking , here you scan down the “me first” posts until you get somewhere. I’ve lost count the amount of arguments ive had on ZH where you shake hands at the end and say ” Good on you – interesting point”
            If the mods keep shutting down comment it just encourages stuff like H . “Noted” What sort of passive aggressive is that? Noted – you’ll try harder to improve your quality of argument now?
            – you’ll keep me to my word about gold and lead?
            – or noted i’m a POS?
            And your insult about medical students cuts deep. I’ve covered how standards are slipping before, now you know.

          • Luke it’s a very good point

            In fact there’s lots of research to show that we SHOULD be wearing helmets in cars

            Why don’t we ?
            No idea .
            Is it worth the impingement on our freedom ?
            Certainly more so than the coronavirus lockdown, as the inconvenience would be relatively very minor

            Reducing the speed limit by another 10kmh is another very rational proposal supported by extensive evidence that would be far better bang for buck in terms of lost productivity vs lives saved than the lockdown and actually save the lives of young people

            Why don’t we do it?
            No idea

          • You don’t sound like medical professionals, I got a PHD so I’m a Dr
            Paging Dr Big Duke, Classic

          • BigDuke6MEMBER

            OK – , thanks folks I enjoyed it.
            “Shakes hands”
            Flies off to snuggle gold nugget.

        • bolstroodMEMBER

          This from your comment to Peter (lower in the thread )
          I believe you’re a medical doctor as well ?
          infers that you are a medical doctor.I have not seen you acknowledge that you are.
          Could you clarify your medical status, it would add weight to your comments if you hold a medical qualification.
          Serious request..

    • You might have a leg to stand on if you raised your contrarian opinions politely and in appropriate places. But, against all advice, you kept up your repetitive multiple posts per thread per day on stories that weren’t even virus related. Then there is you abusing anyone that doesn’t agree with you, insulting their intelligence for having a different opinion or interpreting very loose data in a different way. Free exchange of ideas lol, you’re a flat track bully and now you’re crying unfair.

    • Nah, you’d become a bit of a pest actually.
      I do remember not wanting to come to this site during a period of a week or two because of how every second comment was a full on rant without much value.
      I mean, say it once (or maybe even a couple of times if it’s short) on a related article and then shvt up. We are all invested in the content enough to read through everything.. this site doesnt exactly attract the “skim readers without attention to detail”, so it’s not like anyone is missing any of your commentary.
      It got better, but don’t want it again so I’m glad the warning systems are in place.
      My advice if you want to stay off the radar, is to do what Cheapy does – troll consistently but slightly under the radar.

        • Yeah but .. “I thought some might be interested that the owner of this website is threatening me…”
          I just figured out why this hit a nerve and it’s because it feels like you watched us all defend bcnich the last time he/she was threatened with an eviction off the site.. and now instead of taking the warning for what it is from DLS on a pattern of behaviour (not just the one line comment), you’re trying to invoke the same sympathy from the crowd into blinding defending you.
          “Perhaps there are some others here who feel the same way”. This is another line trying to source a reaction from the crowd instead of actually addressing your grievances to DLS, so no, I don’t feel the same way. Yes, it’s the same censoring action, but it seems to me that you come with different intentions, so the same defense as bcnich doesn’t apply to you.
          “Sorry but not sorry” if those aren’t your true intentions and it feels like I’m drawing a long bow but instincts – I’m gonna listen to them, they’re there for a reason.

          • I mean I did ask him, but of course got no response

            Bcnich is and was absolutely laughable with his sunspot thesis but I enjoy crackpots and crackpot theories , and I thought it was disgraceful he was banned

            I don’t like censorship of any kind

            Quite a few people here have acknowledged that I was entirely correct months before anyone else , so I’m satisfied with that

          • Coming. Bcnich was not banned. There was a small kerfuffle and talk of possibly removing comments referring to sunspots.He left temporarily of his own volition. I am glad to see him back. But I wouldn’t give a rat’s @ss if I never read another coming comment. It’s monotonous. Why are we being badgered? Isn’t there a bigger, more influential place you can fight your good fight? Here at MB we have heard it all ten times already. Same to you doctorX

          • is it as monotonous as discussing the imminent (18 months) house price collapse, Arthur?
            We’ve been at that for nearly 10 years now

            What an absurd argument

            David Collyer has been posting the same dangerous propaganda every single for literally years (meanwhile house prices have doubled)
            Should we ban him?

            The fact is that, until today, I made perhaps 1-2 comments for the whole week regarding coronavirus leading up to my warning
            If you find that monotonous, I fear for your mental health

          • david collyerMEMBER

            Dangerous propaganda?!?

            Listen you dopey prick, and listen well: a market is made of many views, collectively they distill to price. Censor one voice and genuine discovery goes out the window. My views are as legitimate as the ABA’s. I perform a great civic duty sprinkling caution where there is none.

            The great and noble impulse driving Australia was the genuine heartfelt desire for every family to own their home on freehold title, where no man need pull the forelock to another, where respect was earned and re-earned.

            Instead, it has become a monopolist’s paradise, where the law leaps to protect lazy wealth placed to rents while bleeding labour and enterprise with taxes.

            Meanwhile, despite Australia’s Constitution clearly proclaiming the mineral wealth of this continent belongs to the people through the agency of government, 90% of miners are overseas-owned and the bounty of our land is spent in London, New York and elsewhere.

            We have much work to do.

          • David, you’ve been wrong for 10 years

            let’s be real

            The best time to buy was 10 years ago, it just get worse every day and will continue to do so

        • DominicMEMBER

          Allow me to settle this:
          – I am the biggest free speech advocate
          – however, this is a privately run site and the owners are free to moderate should they wish to and in whatever fashion they wish to.
          – if you wish to tell the world what you’re thinking, you are free to do so – from your own platform
          – those that care for what you say may well follow you there
          – I’m sure DLS would be happy for you to post a link to your very own site

    • I respect you have had a strong difference of opinion on the virus. I don’t agree with you, but willing to hear your side, but at times it has been quite abrasive too. I think MB has been fair in terms of giving you a warning to be honest. Surprised it didn’t come sooner actually.

      • It’s fine to have a difference of opinion

        The value comes from explaining/justifying it

        His own table shows Australians are less concerned about coronavirus (go have a look at the table and use your own brain/eyes)

        I pointed that out, and that gets called propaganda ?

        • MB authors do love to accuse people of being spruikers or conspiracy theorists etc.. I’ve seen Peachy get a slap and anyone else with a dissenting opinion. Which I think is a bit unfair, but I also can’t tell how serious they are. I’m sure there is a lot of paid for comment astroturfers out there, but not everyone who has a strong opposite opinion is 1.

          I’ve had some of my comments get sent to Spam bot and never see the light of day. But on the whole I don’t feel that I’ve ever been suppressed, but maybe muzzled here and there. Although probably for my own good

          • They do love it

            And , ironically, accusing peachy of being a banking astroturfer is the most absurd conspiracy theory I’ve ever seen here

            The scariest part is that there is no logic or explanation provided
            I made literally one comment on that article, consisting of one line
            And had barely mentioned coronavirus for days prior to that

            Sadly, the comments here as well as the links are largely the best part of the site, as the actual original content is pretty poor and the authors largely have no idea about monetary mechanics which are really the main game in town (and have been since 2008)

            I still like to support the site because of their politics and dedication to exposing Australian corruption

          • You had my attention at “peachy getting slapped”… pray tell, where was afore mentioned ‘slap’ applied, and what size paddle was used in the process?

    • You are valued here.

      Probably over-did the virus stuff, but please don’t feel like you aren’t welcome (you can’t please everyone).

      DLS and mods might be trying to reverse some of the alt-right moves that the comments section has been taking in the last few months, in the sense that it’s become a bit more of a Zerohedge pit – which I don’t want. Seems to have calmed down a bit more lately, which is good. If mods have been harsh on you then it’s possible that you’ve been caught up in the sweep more than you deserve?

      • If I overdid the virus stuff it’s because I thought rationality and logic had completely left the discussion, and I was seemingly the only one able to bring it back

        I presented actual scientific data and worked through it

        In early March I was saying the mortality would be 0.3% when everyone here was claiming it was 10% (with no basis in reality)

        And of course I was proven correct

        At a certain point I realised that logic and reason is subordinate to emotion so I gave up trying to convince the religious zealots here

        I only posted a one line response to highlight that the most obvious interpretation of the data had been completely disregarded , just in case there are any open minded people out there reading

        • Know IdeaMEMBER

          Sure. No one doubts your facts or your commitment to them. But in terms of pedagogical prowess, you and Skippy are in a league of your own. You won the battle but lost the war. Huzzah!

    • different opinions and interpretations are good. people who selectively pick and choose evidence just to server their predefined conclusions are less valuable. when combined with a dogmatic certainty in the face of uncertain and rapidly evolving data – it moves into ideological propaganda. when you throw in half-baked conspiracy theories on top – it’s becomes next to useless. and repetitive.

      i take your posts with a grain of salt. you claim that you sold all your shares and went to cash pre-drop – even though you were posting that cash was trash on here at the same time. given that, i can only assume that you are posting your ‘just the flu’ campaign while self-isolating at home, wearing a face mask, getting your groceries delivered at home and spraying the bags with alcohol before you drag them inside with a broom…

      i think you like the attention mate, but the endorphins of feeling like you’re the oppresed voice of truth in this small pond won’t give you much joy in real life – go for a walk.

      • Well, cash was trash

        It took a once in a hundred year unforeseeable event to temporarily drop asset prices
        And now up they go again

        So please don’t tell me you and bcnich predicted the coronavirus and subsequent hysteria

    • I have agreed with your and drx POV of late and I’m glad you kept some balance to the convo. I was in favour of lockdowns early on as the data was minimal but now we know more and I see how mad my state elected have become with power in response to such minimal risk. Keep up your POV, MB can call it out great sometimes but in a few instances they take their opinion too far and can’t back track similar to our politicians. They are still a much better source of info than the mainstream but are not the be all and end all sometimes.

      • thanks very much – I appreciate that. Reassuring that there are open minded, intelligent people out there willing to think on their ownh

        I don’t mind being abused or argued with, but when presenting facts starts getting called “propaganda”, and those doing so are threatened, I get very concerned

        • There is also a fair bit of disagreement with a differing opinion here because i’ve noticed many commenters are borderline commies. I mean who on earth would want a UBI after this forcing me to be fully dependant on the government? They also seem to want to stay in lockdown forever.

          • If you were shipwrecked on an island with a large group of other people, would you approve of any land on the island being divided into “private property” lots, with an equal share given to each person?

      • Coming, I agree with CharlieM.Being an objective person I am always willing to change my views when the facts change.Both you and DocX have copped a fair bit on here with your contrarian views.But the way things are shaping it is only a matter of time both of you get due recognition for your POV.As for MB they have been more wrong than right!

    • I would have already banned you. There is a difference between making a point (even repeating that same point a few times), and hijacking every single conversation on the matter. The latter is political activism.

      You also carry on as though you are always right. My recollection is your CFR estimate was initially very low and has been slowly creeping up to 0.39% this week? and still just a bad flu? How high does the CFR have to go before it is more serious than just a bad flu?

      • You’re confusing CFR and IFR
        I don’t have any dispute with the CFR but its really irrelevant to the discussion of overall mortality (and appropriateness of lockdown) if the vast majority of infections are asymptomatic

        I always said IFR is 0.3% or thereabouts – a bad flu (normal flu is 0.1%)
        I had previously been willing to accept it might be ~0.6%

        Please note I wasn’t threatened for overposting or commenting on too many threads (I made literally one post about coronavirus that day)

        If that was the case, hugh pavlevitch and david collyer should have been banned years ago

        I was threatened for “propaganda”

        That propaganda consists of presenting actual data and scientific evidence

        If that kind of authoritarianism and censorship doesn’t frighten you, I don’t know what will

        • This site is DLS’ private property.

          Some of those “scientific” stats have been debunked within a few days of posting. The ones I can remember are the effectiveness of oxygen respirator debunked by the doctor on MedCram. The antibody testing to determine the population spread of the virus debunked by Chris Martenson as non-random. i.e. people were asked to come forward for the testing, which means the results were skewed by people that wanting confirmation that they had previously contracted the virus.

          Here are some stats for you:
          1) 0.15% of the entire New York State population is already dead from Covid.
          2) The overall deaths much higher this year than last year, with only half of those additional deaths being accounted for in the Covid death statistics.

          • His property, and I’m a paying customer

            Do you support other businesses being able to ban people for their opinions or beliefs?
            I’m not violating the terms of service (I’ve read them – have you?)

            There have been multiple antibody trials run around the world, encompassing various different tests sampled millions of times, with varying methodologies, and selection, and the answers have all been the same in the region of 0.2-0.4%
            Recent meta-analysis confirmed this

            The one I’ve quoted yesterday was at the higher end of the range

            I don’t think chris martenson is an epidemiologist, scientist or doctor is he?

            25,000 coronavirus deaths in new york state
            population 20,000,000
            which is 0.125% of the population

            Already in April, antibody tests were showing 20% of the population as having been infected at some point
            So by the end May it is probably closer to 40%
            which would fit very precisely with a mortality rate of 0.39%

            As far as the overall deaths being much higher this year than last year
            Well yeah, that’s what happens when you unleash a novel virus on humans for the first time in their evolutionary history
            The point is: the magnitude is really quite small when looked at rationally, and most of the people who died from it were decrepit and probably would have died from something else in the meantime
            And there isn’t much you can really do about it

          • Not a question of banning you for your beliefs. If you owned a restaurant and one of your customers put your profitability at risk by constantly preaching religion to others then you would do exactly what DLS has done.

            Chris Martenson is actually a PHD in Pathology. That aside, much like the “as a doctor” discussion below, he doesn’t need to be a PHD of anything to point out the flaws in testing methodology.

            NY population 19.5M and 29k deaths. I will also point out that 2/3 of confirmed cases are still active.

            The comorbidity thing again. There is the propaganda. They would have survived without the virus. End of story.

          • he didn’t threaten me for constantly preaching my beliefs

            He threatened me for posting “propaganda”

            If you go and read the sole post I made about coronavirus on that day, you can see it was a one line statement regarding a rather obvious interpretation of the data he himself had posted

            I don;’t really know who chris martenson is sorry. I had the vague impression he was some kind of economics talking head
            The studies have been repeated over and over again, in various hot spots over the world using various methodologies and testing kits.

            I’m not sure I’m understanding how you are disputing my point regarding NY state
            I have found from google 23,198 deaths in new york state which would actually be around 0.11-0.12%

            In any case, if it is 0.15% it doesn’t materially change the reasonable inference
            The mortality is pretty clearly in the range of 0.2-0.4% using the estimated number of deaths, and the estimated number of infections

            It only proves my thesis

            If you’re interested, and have experience with reading scientific studies yourself, you can check out the meta-analysis here
            Obviously this links to the individual studies

            Undoubtedly there are methodological flaws, but all studies point the same direction as does your own New York data

        • can i be in a third position whereby i’m more on the side of coming/doctorx re: the actual threat of the virus, but i still support the lockdowns anyway because they’re the only plausible thing that can bring the hammer to mass immigration and the housing economy?

          also they make it easier to get a park in the main street

          • perfectly rational

            I disagree, but I can at least appreciate the logic

            And it is more the incredible stupidity and ignorance that I object to, rather than the lockdown per se.
            I have quite enjoyed the peace and quiet

      • matthewMEMBER

        I would also have banned you.Your arrogance and ad hominum attacks are to much.In addition as a doctor I disagree with you

        • As a doctor…lol. Like that makes you an epidemiology expert. The majority of the doctors and nurses wanted the lockdown and you are one doctor everybody should have listened to.

          • My only medically related opinion is in support of all the medical experts that called for the lockdown. “as a doctor” what exactly are you disagreeing with?

          • He’s saying your claim that my arrogance should get me banned is ironic, as you are demonstrating your own arrogance by declaring “as a doctor”

            As a doctor, you are an embarrassment to the profession if you are not smart enough to understand what he mean

          • matthew are you really so stupid you don’t appreciate the irony of your statement?

          • I admit I was a bit confused by Matthew responding to my post. I initially thought his comments were directed at me. But otherwise yes, there was the irony of arrogance and ad hominem in his comments.

        • matthewMEMBER

          The only reason I mentioned my medical background was to counter the previous medico who agrees with the stance held by coming such that the readers are aware that not all(in fact none that I know)doctors agree.Had nothing to do with arrogance.With regards to irony you will note that I was addressing the topic of discussion

          • as a doctor, I don’t think you’ve even managed to work out how to reply to the correct message

            There are duds in every field though

    • TightwadMEMBER

      Yes. I cannot understand why alternate opinion is censored on this site unless the proprietor has so much personal kudos tied to his ‘propaganda’ that he is not on strong enough ground to withstand debate on it.
      I have stated that I won’t be renewing if reasoned and polite debate is censored, if I wanted that I would move to a dictatorship where you have to toe the party line and I’m certainly not going to continue paying to be force fed someone else’s opinion without the right of reply.

      • DingwallMEMBER

        “… if reasoned and polite debate is censored”
        What is deemed “reasoned” or “polite” by you can be deemed totally differently by someone else….. if you think your line has been crossed then find somewhere else … simple

        • TightwadMEMBER

          It seems an alternate viewpoint is deemed unacceptable and I thought I had made it clear I don’t intend to renew and pay for the privilege of being told what to think and believe.

      • “Yes. I cannot understand why alternate opinion is censored on this site ”
        I don’t think it’s just alternate opinion, I think it’s the amount of it in this case. It’s been excessive to the point where it amounts to a propaganda where one point of view on an issue is blared on megaphones drowning out all others. In fact, what Coming is accusing DLS of is just projecting what he’s been doing – shutting out any other opinion other than his own by harassment and abuse.

        Just today to matthew in this post for saying he’s a doctor and doesn’t agree with Coming on wuflu:
        “you are an embarrassment to the profession”
        “are you really so stupid …”
        “There are duds in every field…”

        Who wants to read this?

        So instead of taking the warning, Coming has decided “I’ll just dob in DLS on the comments forum and gather support from the sheep to put the pressure on DLS because I saw them defend that other guy last month for a similar thing. That’s how I’ll get back at DLS; alienate him by getting everyone on the site on my side and they’ll fight my battle for me”.
        It’s manipulative b.s and probably didn’t expect any of us to pick at the small issue of integrity in the process.

        I think the only contention is, DLS wants to ban Coming for “propaganda” which isn’t specifically called out in comments rules, but could have just as easily banned him for being abusive towards others. And that’s in the comments rules.

        • Yeah, he posted a day after the comment was posted – so nobody else would read it
          He refuses to answer any sort of questions about what in particular was considered “propaganda”

          and as far as abuse, I’ve received far more than I’ve been given

          I was being called a psychopath when I was originally pointing out the real mortality

          I have been right from the very beginning
          about the virus mortality
          about the asset price bailout

    • I doubt whinging publically about moderation actions or warnings will win you any sympathy and on pretty much any discussion site doing so eventually results in further penalties. To a neutral observer it comes across as childish and petulant, like someone who is unable to take responsibility for their own behaviour.
      When people constantly post in a repetitive fashion eventually what happens is that most will take the default option of glossing over such posts when they read their username. Some will probably get ticked off, although I can’t see any easily accessible report function which suggest that you’ve probably bothered enough people to contact HnH or LvO directly. Some sites might even view this sort of posting as spam or trolling, and on a lot of other sites you’d have been banned without a second thought, although as a paying member this probably influences the MB decision making process towards being more lenient.

      • The Traveling Wilbur

        Dear Spenthouse,

        First time sender, long time letter reader. I couldn’t believe what happened on my way to pickup my contactless Pizza last week and thought other readers would want to know.

        It was late in the afternoon and the twilight hours were drawing near as I strolled down the avenue keeping a socially acceptable distance from the heavily wrapped cavalcade of pedestrians, when suddenly a tug on my jacket sleeve turned into a firm yank and I was suddenly face to face with a blue eyed shiny-teethed estate agent.

        I could tell they were an estate agent straight away. The billboard she was standing in front of had her picture on it. Oddly, she seemed to have shaved off her moustache and had lasic on her right eye recently. Or at least since the picture for the billboard was taken anyway.

        “Please sir, take an EOI application form.” she whispered to me, breathlessly.
        “Not interested.”
        “It’s the opportunity of a lifetime.” she said as she batted her licence accreditation at me.
        “Not interested.”
        “The vendor is *very* motivated as the property they were planning to buy themselves has been undervalued by the bank, and now they have to sell a second IP to fund that deal.” she said as her hand slowly carressed the pen she’d brought to capture all the potential-buyer COVID details, while gently attempting to push it into my gloved hand.
        “Not interested.”
        “But their tenants in the second property are about to move out to a cheaper rental so you won’t need to worry about the remainder of the fixed five-year lease they have, if occupancy was a concern?” she asked nervously, her voice cracking slightly over the word “cheaper”.
        “Not interested.”
        “If you want to come back to the office with me, I can see to some favourable arrangements for any perspective lending you might need for settlement?” she coyly propositioned.
        “Very favourable, if you know what I mean…”.
        “Not interested.”
        “We’ll pay the rent for any tenant you want to put into the property for the first three months! Please, just one form, please, take one.” she cried.
        “Not interested.”
        “Every open home comes catered. With coffee and doughnuts.” she sobbed tearfully into the lapel of her yellow company-suit jacket.
        And at that, I relented, and took a form.
        I feel so guilty, it’s the first time I’ve done anything like this.
        I just hope the missus doesn’t find out.

        • I am GrootMEMBER

          Have you by chance considered a side hustle as a writer of erotic fiction?

          I feel you have some talent.

          • The Traveling Wilbur

            Thanks. But the audience for Housing Bear related erotic fiction is A: a bit limited B: comprised mostly of MB readers. So I figure I’m already reaching almost the entire target market anyway and will have to content myself in terms of recompense with the joy that thinking of the pleasuring others may take from such bon mots brings.

            Edit: pleasures! I meant pleasures!!! 😄

  7. Stewie GriffinMEMBER

    Obama Gate

    Two words that I’ve yet to hear mentioned on MB, although in fairness this is more a blog site about current events and future possibilities rather than past events, but still given the implications I would have thought it would warrant an occassional mention or at least a link or two in the ‘readings’ page.

    Fortunately the White House has released a 4 point slide outlining it:

    1. “Why did the Obama Admin use opposition research, funded by a political organization and filled with foreign dirt to SPY ON MEMBERS OF THE TRUMP CAMPAIGN?”

    2. “Why was Lt. Gen. Micahel Flynn UNMASKED by Obama’s Chief of Staff, Joe Biden, Susan Rice, and others?”

    3. “Why was Flynn’s identity leaked – A CRIMINAL ACT – to the press?”

    4. “Why did the DOJ learn about the FBI’s interest in Flynn’s conversations with the Russian Amb. from a CONVERSATION WITH OBAMA in the Oval Office?”

    I’m sure Chris with all his Russian Conspiracy theories and links would be keen to find out just how wrong he was.


    But since so many people like getting their news from the “news”, here is a video by the White House press secretary laying it all out… I’m sure the ABC or SBS will be running it any day now.


    • Yeah because the ABC and SBS always carry in full marketing pieces put out by the White House. Pearl clutching much?

      PS It’s one word, you goose. Reminds me of Norman May’s memorable line.

      • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

        “Goose” nice ad hominem, now why don’t you try and respond with an explanation as to why Michael Flynn is irrelevant?

        You do realise that Flynn formed the whole basis for the Steele dossier right? That discredited piece of DNC paid for propoganda.

        You do realise that the basis of the Steele report was then used to spy on Trumps staff and electoral team – effectively turning the powers of the US state against a politician running for office?

        You do realise that Obama signed off on his unmasking as a political payback.

        Probably not, because ignoring wrong doing is okay when it occurs by those whose opinions and values you share.

        PS: Triage is something performed at the front line, deciding who gets the medical attention and the priority. I’d rank the gaping wound between your ears as being pretty high up in terms of requiring attention.

        • Interested PartyMEMBER

          “Obama signed off on his unmasking as a political payback.”
          Um…..no, not really. Time will show you that it was a protection racket to hide the Muslim Brotherhood connections that have/had infiltrated the US gov at the highest levels. The USA was one presidency away from falling. It’s why the US Constitution is defended by this administration so virulently. Think judicial appointments, etc.
          Simultaneously, congress, the senate, and wall street had conspired and effectively sold America off to china for personal profit.
          Very few patriots were left when Trump became POTUS. This is why it has taken so long for any traction regarding swamp draining. Deep state sleepers everywhere….with rubbish claims of russian/ukrainian connections. Most key positions are now filled with those of a patriotic streak….particularly the ODNI where the recent declass came from, which exposed the duplicitous obama admin members for who and what they really are. Human scum….as Trump calls them.

      • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

        A much more reasonable retort – true.

        But there is enough evidence to warrant an investigation – if they could hold an Inquisition for Trump over Russiagate, then they should be able to hold an equivalent investigation into the suggestion that the Obama or certainly his leadership team may have used manufactured evidence in order to turn the full investigative powers of the US onto a political opponent.

        The thing that grates is that despite the flimsy evidence of Russian collusion in Trumps election and the resulting media witch hunt the mainstream media have placed this potential scandal completely in the dome of silence. The implications if true are just as far reaching as were if the Russian collusion conspiracy theory were true – indeed they strike at the heart of the separation of state and abuse of political power.

      • Trumpy yells SQUIRREL!! and all the nut jobs – not including Wing Nut esquire and spouse of course – go scampering off into the forest once again. Trumpy is a grifter no more no less.

          • Yeah, I’d figured that much out, but thanks. And no, doesn’t hurt at all, seeing I’m not an American. But, having said that, I would not be looking forward to the next federal election if the two contenders were John Howard and Kim Beazley.

    • Link broken. To be honest $1.2m for St Kilda isn’t that bad when you consider how much they ask for ,400sqm of pure shyte in Officer or Tarneit.

  8. I used to regularly read Paul Kedrosky’s blog but have not done so for some years. And this article reminds me of why I stopped. I would describe what he penned here as being clever without being sage.

    For instance, he says “Overall, we believe we will quickly return to a state much like where we were before recent events. It will be less different than many pundits expect. ” but then says “There will be explosive economic, biological, and technological moves, much more explosive than in the recent past”. Either way he will be able to claim profundity and prescience.

    Anyway, enjoy the cleverness.


    • DominicMEMBER

      There’s an old saying: if it sounds like bollox and smells like bollox, it likely is bollox.

      Not something you‘ll come across in academia, obviously, but some good street wisdom.

  9. Central banks would have you believe that they are apolitical and have no agency, this documentary says otherwise.
    Quote: ’Crises can be engineered, to facilitate the redistribution of economic ownership, and to implement legal, structural and political change.’
    (Also see Hegelian dialectic of problem – reaction – solution).
    An example is shown in ’The Princes Of The Yen’, an adaptation of the book by Professor Richard Werner, an ‘insider’ who often appears in this docu. It details how in the 1980s, when Japan was growing very prosperous from the post war miracle economy, built on Japanese style capitalism, the Bank of Japan instead wanted the country to adopt the free market style economy. Due to considerable pushback from establishment groups, the BOJ understood that change would only be possible through a crisis. To foment the crisis, they created a real estate bubble, and when the epic bust brought Japan to its knees in the early 90s, the old system was blamed, and the free market economy was offered as the solution.
    The docu also touches on how the ECB (European Central Bank) handled the European debt crisis that is still ongoing today. Statements made about the ECB:
    -the ECB is an international organisation that is above and outside the law, and jurisdiction, of any individual nation
    -according to the Maastricht Treaty, it is forbidden to try to influence the ECB through democratic debate and discussion
    -the deliberations of the ECB decision making bodies are secret
    -files and documents inside the ECB cannot be searched or impounded by any police force or public prosecutor
    -senior ECB staff carry diplomatic passports
    ‘Princes Of The Yen’: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5-IZZxyb1GI

    • my exact response on clicking the link…. he can go shake his own sauce bottle…

    • That got me looking at exercise bikes.
      This one impressed me.
      A nice wood finish for something that won’t be heading outside.
      A design that doesn’t pretend you will be on the road.
      I’d like to try it out to see if it is actually good for riding on the spot.

      • Mining BoganMEMBER

        That’s a bit flash. Looks like the stuff the 40 kilos overweight business executive has in the corner of his office so the sucks can walk in, point and ask if he’s been training again. Not as showy as a lot of the kit I see on the roads though.

        Is it compatible with Zwift or Sufferfest or the like?

        • I don’t think so. The rest of their equipment is also wood finished. That’s definitely a nicer, if more expensive way to deck our the home gym. Add a few potplants, a bar, a library and a reading chair and you’d have quite the nice man cave.

  10. Legendary trader/investor Paul Tudor Jones in the documentary ‘Trader’ from 1987.
    Rumour has is that PTJ tried to buy up all the copies of the movie to have them destroyed, for reasons only known to himself.
    After watching it I think that maybe he was afraid that clients wouldn’t take him seriously, this was still early in his career, after seeing him putting on his ‘lucky tennis shoes’ and using an inflatable dinosaur in the office to ‘chase the bears back to their den.’
    Enjoy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYjL1uY2rv8

  11. SweeperMEMBER

    Just listened to the housing podcast and was very good. 2 more things I think to consider:
    1. Fiscal policy on the other side. With payroll tax/land tax relief, lower GST receipts (which were already weak before virus), lower stamp duty with lower housing turnover, State budgets in particular are not going to look good. imo there will be a push to austerity with public sector wages and services, probably from the federal government as well. MMT won’t happen. This will overwhelm any interest rate effect as fiscal policy is more potent at lower interest rates.
    2. Commercial property losses in the banks. Could potentially slow overall lending.

    • Sweeper …

      MMT is and has been happening for yonks, administration of it is the sticking point, made confusing due to the ad hoc nature of it with elements of the old gold standard bolted onto it [politics]. I mean why do you think there is such a drama around the IS-LM with Taylor rule bolt on [MMT]. Its got nothing to do with the accounting, its all about the ideological template and its path dependency baked in.

      Heck the unwashed might get the idea they can – have – concrete material benefits without having to worship some squillionaire.

  12. Mining BoganMEMBER

    Bought online a couple of pair of levi jeans on sale. Haven’t worn them for years.

    When did their material get so thin? Glad they were only $40 each.

    • I feel your pain and disgust. The old stuff is the good stuff. I recently pulled out my pair of Blunnies I bought in late 90s for $28 at the Frankston Aussie Disposals. Just a tiny bit of fraying of the top elastic. Love wearing them, I looked after them, they survived years of gigging in Beijing. Need a polish though. Mum went through the kitchen and I scored a wholebunch of old Bendigo Pottery and NZ stoneware kitchen stuff for that hopeful move to my first home, plus a huge glad salt container worth a wooden lid (the olds couldn’t get over how much salt people used to get through). I’m so looking forward to using it.

      • Blundstone shifted manufacture to China from Hobart around late 90s /2000. I have never bought another pair. Red back make a similar ,better product in australia for the same price!

        • I’m a big fan of the redbacks but my latest pair have only lasted 2 years before the soles have started coming off. Could probably get them reglued and I have flogged them but also looked after them pretty well so a bit miffed. If they can’t be fixed I’ll grab another set and see how they go, so hard to find good boots these days.

    • Goldstandard1MEMBER

      There’s a real general trend in people only being able to afford the cheap stuff now.
      When I informed my wife of ‘Target’ retailer closing and some will turn into Kmarts, she said “Target was always a bit better quality so looks like the cheap model won with Wesfarmers.” Fair call I thought.

      • Mining BoganMEMBER

        I read that Levi sells different quality jeans in different outlets. I’m now wondering if these ones I bought from the Levi website are ones made for the lower end shops that are now closing. The sale started during the week so I’m guessing Target stopped taking delivery a while before the announcement? Who knows.

    • Denim is sold by weight per yard that ranges from 5 ounces to 32 ounces. 5 ounce demon is a softer, more flexible fabric while 32 ounce is heavier and stiffer. Average denim jean weight is around 12-14 ounces. Also, the quality of demon varies depend on where the material is milled. The better quality material will attract a better price at the Levi shop where as the cheap stuff will wind up in Target.

      • I am GrootMEMBER

        I generally find the quality of demon is more dependent on the spell used to summon it.

    • Depends where you buy em. I bought a heap off amazon back when the poo was above parity and they were all very thin. Most places in oz sell the thick denim. I have some prison blues from the states thar ar ed also the thick stuff.

  13. Just bought a nice couch off someone who was virtually giving it away because they are letting their house and moving back in with their parents.

    I didn’t pry but the situation screams fire sale due to economic stress.

  14. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8347901/US-states-LOWER-infection-rates-lockdowns-end-study-claims.html

    Thought this was an interesting info, though I certainly wouldn’t want to be deemed to be spreading propaganda

    Using the dailymail link because it isn’t paywalled

    the vast majority of countries had decreased infection rates after lockdowns were lifted, and R0 barely changed after lockdown was lifted

    Kolanovic said governments had been spooked by ‘flawed scientific papers’ into imposing lockdowns that were ‘inefficient or late’ and had little effect.

    ‘While we often hear that lockdowns are driven by scientific models, and that there is an exact relationship between the level of economic activity and the spread of [the] virus – this is not supported by the data,’ the report says.

    ‘Indeed, virtually everywhere infection rates have declined after re-opening even after allowing for an appropriate measurement lag.

    ‘This means that the pandemic and COVID-19 likely have (their) own dynamics unrelated to often inconsistent lockdown measures that were being implemented.’

    Those dynamics may be influenced by increased hand-washing and even weather patterns but seemingly not by full-scale lockdowns, the report suggests.

    ‘The fact that re-opening did not change the course of the pandemic is consistent with studies showing that initiation of full lockdowns did not alter the course of the pandemic either,’ it says.

    • Ronin8317MEMBER

      Cart before the horse? Logic would say lower infection rate leads to removal of lockdown, not the other way around.

      I have no idea why some people thinks the economy won’t be impacted without as lockdown. Chinese restaurants in Australia were already cloosing down in February. Once the virus runs rampant, people will stop going out and businesses will close down, lockdown or not. Contrast this to Australia right now: people believe the virus has been beaten and their wallets are open again: it is a very good time to be a retailer right now. (Unless you are Myers)

      What we have seen so far is once COVID-19 gets into a nursing home, people will quickly die. Sweden now have as death rate exceeding 10%, and it’ll take them another 2 years to reach ‘herd immunity’. The real policy is senicide.

      • Did you read the article ?

        The R0 DECLINED after lockdowns ended
        Implying that the lockdown measures are mainly irrelevant to the spread of the disease
        A point made repeatedly by DoctorX

        I can’t find the full methodology because it’s presumably proprietary for JP Morgan customers

        You might argue that it’s because people remained on self lockdown but that’s not true as the link yesterday showed, and as many have noted a lot of people are out and about
        A sizeable number should move the stats
        Unless somehow ending the lockdown caused some people to be even MORE cautious
        But that seems unlikely as they were cowering in their homes regardless

        Yes, the media hysteria did result in a lot of people locking themselves down regardless I agree

        • Jim's Central Banking

          R0 declining after lockdowns end doesn’t imply lockdowns are irrelevant to disease spread at all – that’s exactly what the lockdowns are trying to achieve.

          Because of the lockdown infectious people are mainly limited to infecting those they live with. Think of the lockdown as similar to doing controlled burns to prevent out of control bushfires – the virus runs its peak infection cycle in small pockets rather than running though the population.

          R0 declining after lockdown is exactly what is intended.

          • What you’re claiming is that R0 is falling (despite the lifting of lockdown) is because a large number of people have already achieved immunity

            Is that correct?

            Firstly, immunity develops gradually. Suddenly lifting lockdown should have a sudden effect on R0, if lockdown has any meaningful impact on infection spread
            Day before lockdown immune % of population is x
            Day after lockdown immune % of population is x not much
            Now why would the imaginary large effect of lockdown being lifted be completely offset by the tiny extra number of immune people generated one day later?

            It wouldn’t

            What you’d expect to see would be
            -a sudden drop in R0 as lockdown when introduced
            -a further gradual decline as immunity slowly develops
            -a sudden spike in R0 as lockdown when lifted
            -continuing further decline as immunity continues to develop

            None of that happened

      • The western media in Japan seem positively angry and disappointed that Japan didn’t become a batvirus morgue. But they are happy to report that people under 70 can die from it, so their work is done, apparently.

      • I’m going to have to start making an effort here to at least call out some of the b.s. so that the loudest dont just auto win arguments.

        That article specifically mentions:
        “Even though Japan did not impose a strict lockdown but a voluntary stay-at-home measure, people did follow it well and kept social distancing at the level of a strict lockdown in other countries,” he said

        So it seems that although they didnt impose strict lockdown lile Aus did, the public implemented a strict lockdown themselves anyway!
        Soo…. strict lockdowns may still actually work then????
        At the very least, it isnt conclusively what you say “support against lockdown”.

        And you have done no analysis to compare the remaining callouts by the article:
        – large older people population in japan and its comparison to aus
        – difference in hygiene levels “People in this country are generally very clean. They like to be clean, they wash hands very frequently on normal days and they don’t kiss, they don’t hug,”
        – BCG vaccinations still given to kids in Japan. Do we do this here or is that debunked?
        – “the fact many Japanese people wear masks may have helped” vs aussies dont have a culture of mask wearing
        – “Japan has universal health coverage … and we are proud of this healthcare system that is not behind any other nation.” Australia also has medicare.

        Some of these callouts are in line with Australia and others are not. Point is, you havent actually dug into it and are simply parroting a predetermined view.
        Now, either you havent actually read the article and are blindly posting anything resembling your views or have read it and are specifically manipulating the message to fit your views.
        And once you do this numerous times in a single page, it amounts to propaganda pushing a message only you want seen on the page forcing my eyeballs to absorb these messages.
        Most other sites would have banned you for far less. And perhaps they have.. giving you more time to troll on here..

        Edit: i dont actually want your full analysis of the article NOW after I have pointed it out. My point is, you dont actually do it but repeatedly post anyway. It is to demonstrate WHY you are getting those warnings from DLS.
        Theres 10mins of my life I will never get back.

        • don’t think I ever made any comment on the article

          Usually abc nonsense

          So, was the lockdown necessary or not?

    • SweeperMEMBER

      “The fact that re-opening did not change the course of the pandemic is consistent with studies showing that initiation of full lockdowns did not alter the course of the pandemic either”

      Should be.. is consistent with the belief that initiation of full lockdowns did not alter the course of the pandemic. Where are the studies?

      A more plausible explanation (which ties back to evidence) would be that post the official lock-down, people largely stayed at home and washed their hands more etc.

      • so you’re saying there was no need to officially end the lockdown, because everyone would continue to stay home?

        Really, just stupid

  15. Another update from the low income end of the economy. We had a FB update meeting from from work (council owned company operating the recently built pool/gym/cafe/creche/hydrotherapy/swim school facilties) yesterday regarding what reopening might look like when we eventually get to do that. Everything possible will be done to ensure no one with any possible exposure to CV will allowed into the centre, lots of questions asked upon entry, temp checks, contact details taken, anyone with any symptoms that might indicate infection not allowed access, inc employees (so no working with any kind of illness). Work will be wanting everyone entering the centre to have CV safe app as we do not want to be a Cedar Meats. At the start use of the facility will probably be by booking only. Possibly only 20 people allowed on pool deck at any one time. Silly me as a permanent part-time employee (20 hours per week) thought I’d get my hours back before work was farmed out to casuals (we have 5-6 part time life guards on 20-25 hours each and ~100 casual LGs). Nope that’s not how we will do it. Work is trying to avoid terminating anyone’s employment, even during the anticipated 12-18 month re-opening phase, we’ve all been stood down but they want us all back if possible. So everyone inc full time staff will be working reduced hours when we re-open. Hours are to be spread as much as possible around as many people as possible within all the departments. They understand most of us are on benefits and might not want to work above a certain number of hours so we don’t lose those benefits. Upshot was they don’t believe it cutting resources to make ends meet as it can damage prospects of long-term profitability 9i’m guessing they are also being sensitive to community opinion). They are focused on members, staff and community health/well-being. This part of the council will not be breaking even for a very long time (we were operating on a cover costs and maybe up to 300K profit basis) but still has to provide services to the community. So it was reassuring in some respects but realising that I’ll be underemployed for perhaps up to 18 months after we re-open was a blow. Although I can’t work full time I have been incredibly lucky to have had as much work as I have wanted for most of the 3 years I’ve been working since returning to Oz.

    However it rammed home to me just how much underemployment there is going to be in the economy. We have 300 employees, the majority of whom are casual due to the nature of most of our work (mgmt tries to get as many people as possible to convert to part-time but not many do). The competition for shifts and work in the sport and recreation industry will be insane. Same goes for all the other heavily Covid affected industries. And it be prolonged because we won’t go back to pre-lockdown levels ever, and it’ll probably take 18 months at least to get to 80% of our old levels which is perhaps the best we can hope for.

    All those people in the media saying that immigration needs to be restarted and throw the gates wide open, and everyone who has been saying give temp visa holders JK and JS need their heads read. They have NFI what is about to happen. It is going to be absolute carnage out there. I’m lucky my self funded retiree parents were always financially conservative, only own their ppor and have no debt so they can afford to have their middle aged daughter with an invisible disability live at home and sponge off them. During the initial crisis period I can bank my JS and dream of owning a house in the countryside somewhere which softens any mental health blow from the whole pandemic thing, though of course I’m already starting to worry about what happens when asset testing presumably comes back in Sept along with the old level of payments. This is the real reason I am on the spending strike I detailed on Thu. I don’t have any debt but how the h3ll is everyone else inhabiting the lower echelons of the economy going to manage?

    • This is the reality noone has been willing to see yet. That the entire country is going to be a whole step poorer and people were already stretched in making ends meet…
      Now imagine you had debt that needs to be paid even after the 6 months and JK goes away, with lower pay now. But then, had another home country to go to by just dumping the car at the airport and p1ssing off.
      I can see it taking shape.

      • I agree. I have a pretty broad acquaintance, and I don’t know anyone who hasn’t taken a financial hit, or working less, if at all.
        The underemployment was pretty widespread before the virus, but it’s almost everyone I know who still has a job. ( and that includes a lot of medicos , lawyers too).
        Things are not going back to the previous normal, even with all it’s problems.
        I’m a bit with bcnich – there will need to be a broad safety net, both government and local community , to save a lot of people from drowning. This could get very ugly.

        • I’m coming round to the idea that we are currently in the eye of the storm and many are in sefl-delusional la la land. The punch has landed but the shock hasn’t worn off yet so in general we don’t even know we’ve been punched.

          • That’s a good way of thinking about it.
            And when all the current income supports drop off in September, we’ll definitely be in the problem part of things again.

          • The Traveling Wilbur


            But queue Reusa to explain how the negative Nellies and Nigels won’t even remember COVID come September and to Buy Now while there are still at least some discounts off fair value available to the proles to pick up as for the mice that scramble for breadcrumbs falling from the farmer’s table.

        • GunnamattaMEMBER

          I’m a bit with bcnich – there will need to be a broad safety net, both government and local community , to save a lot of people from drowning. This could get very ugly.

          Well said. Thats why the weekends news about the 60 billion they have discovered will become seriously intense as it becomes more obvious it will be needed. Imagine going to the real estate lobby saying you need to do real estate reform, or trying to fend off calls for tax cuts for pensioners (or whoever), or a corporate tax cut, when all those lobbies think that in extremis you had another 60 billion to play with. Too right it is going to get ugly.

          Down at the suburban level there is plenty of awareness of just how tenuous things are. Part of me wonders if the boys with the ear of Scotty from Marketing wouldnt mind a half excuse to run to en early election later this year – maybe some sort of ‘strategic need’ to provide clear direction in the post COV19 world. I dont think the ALP would get within cooee of them at the moment (though we are only 5 months from the fires of summer).

          Just imagine, if you will, some of the ugliness a freshly reelected ScoMo government might take the opportunity to visit.

    • The FNG.MEMBER

      Not only do we need to find jobs for the hordes of newly un/underemployed, we need to make the economy more accepting of older workers so that they can work on for as long as possible. Might not seem like they need to now, but wait for the rug pull. Is it possible that we are finally trapped and cannot use the mass migration lever? The economy just isn’t strong enough to support it any longer (thats right, in the long run the economy supports mass migration, not the other way around). It wasnt working when the economy was strong. How can it now? The ponzi is dead. Unless someone reanimates that corpse. But then we will have an undead economy not just a dead one. Fast track to lower standard of living and revolution.

      Check mate ponzi scum.

      • Holy crap. You are so so right.
        In the long run the economy supports mass migration, not the other way around.

        That’s why immigrants flock to places with strong economies.. not the other way around. Noone ever heard of people migrating to a bad economy and turning it around.

        Mass immigration has always been about converting the benefits of a strong economy into corporate profits.

        Get people in because our strong economy can support an extra person looking for a job and you will lower labour costs and skim those cost savings as profits to the c-suite and shareholders.

        Get people in because our strong economy can support an extra person needing a job and create extra demand for goods and services. Now, as long as you dont actually invest more into providing these services and just make the joe-public’s piece of the pie smaller, you can skim off the value created with extra demand as profits to the corporates.

        Our economy actually supports mass immigration, which is why it is also pro cyclical. When the economy goes, immigration actually follows.
        More importantly then, without a strong economy to skim off, cororate profits are going to TANK! Because lets face it, skimming of wages and lack of any real productive investment is the only thing that corporates have excelled at in the last decade in this country.

        Thanks for that! I come here for the little light bulb moments like this.

        • Stewie GriffinMEMBER

          Why do you think we had the biggest commodity boom in 100 years and barely any increase in wages?

          The benefits of OUR boom went to Corporate profits and immigrants wanting the same quality of life as we’d already worked to achieve.

  16. The Traveling Wilbur

    *Python. Lubricant. Lots of Whiskey. Gerbil.

    Those are the key ingredients for how it’s done, right? 😉

  17. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2007764

    Remdesivir results published

    The higher number of deaths in the remdesivir group in the sickest patients is probably noise due to the fact that the benefit is only minimal and so a greater sample size would be needed to show benefit in these patients when the only endpoint is death

    I have no idea what the market was expecting so I don’t know how it will affect the Gilead share price, and share indexes generally, but it does provide some justification for using the drug in affected patients

    • reusachtigeMEMBER

      I really appreciate your efforts, thank you! Now if only some of the chicken sh1t posters would get a reprimand for trying to scare people needlessly!!
      Thanks to you and the other medicos who comment here for prescribing to us an expert dose of reality to crush the fear mongering. Cheers!

      • You monster, you just want to watch old people die, amirite? I’m going to have a zoom conference and feel really good about it, and tell everyone on social media how great it was. #lockdownlife #quaranteam

        Actually, to be clear, I’m on team Coming/DrX. Carry on.

    • TailorTrashMEMBER

      How could the banks be so heartless……asking poor mums and dads just trying to get ahead to pay back what they borrowed …….I mean it’s not as if they can actually afford to bay back the million or two ……shocking behaviour by the nasty greedy banks …….shame shame shame

    • Mums and dads housing speculators getting loan relief at the expense of mums and dads bank shareholders. Both are having a go to “get ahead” and “looking after their own retirement”. Which sets of mums and dads should get handouts to ensure they stay on track of getting ahead (of others).

  18. Morty Mulgrew

    Anecdata on Coolum SE qld..in last week or so rentals have dropped from 125 available to 105..Im thinking its stopped rising because owners of AirBnBs are seeing imminent border openings and pulling out of the long term rental market to get the sweet holiday rental moolaa! Or maybe theres an influx of southerners running from the cities 🤷‍♂️

    • Rental availability where I am in Sydney has stopped growing too (remains very high though).
      I also think the AirBnB thing in beach suburbs is going to pull some availability off the market.
      I’m glad I signed a lease for a much better place at less money last week.

      • reusachtigeMEMBER

        Yep, rents are about to boom! Now that we are shaking off the shackles the AirBnB entrepreneurs will be coming back with a vengeance. Good times ahead for sure.

  19. Bit of Brisbane annecdata: Seeing heaps of hire trailers out on the roads moving house.

    And just because it’s apparently all the comments section is for (someone above lol), I’m drinking George Dickel 12 yr old and doing the badly neglected gardens at the new rental. Weed and feed the 3 lawns, bit of trimming and fresh sugar cane mulch on all the garden beds. Got a lot more trimming to do to bring it back to respectable and will probably have to seed the lawns. Any advice on seeding lawns in SEQ winter? Lawns get full sun.

  20. Darwin anecdata.
    The rental market has tightened. Fewer places on the market and they are asking for more than pre covid-19. It’ll be interesting to see when the government support disappears.

    • Same in Canberra.

      Drove past a rental open home in Palmerston (not the NT Palmerston and not anything like it), sh1t loads of cars, people queing on a drizzly cold day.

      • Morty Mulgrew

        I hate to say it…But it looks like its going to be business as usual…Houses here selling for 800k in last 2 weeks…new builds but very small 3 beds…I cant see what can stop this beast if a pandemic and making a large portion of people unemployed cant 🤷‍♂️..Shopping plaza here was also packed today I heard, people queueing up to get into shops! Let the good times roll!

  21. Geez no wonder Coreliar kaboshed their daily index. It’s not showing good things..
    Date Sydney Change in Daily
    23/05/2020 -0.16
    22/05/2020 -0.05
    21/05/2020 -0.03
    20/05/2020 0.01
    19/05/2020 -0.10
    18/05/2020 0.03
    17/05/2020 0.09
    Weekly totals for Sydney -0.21 counting from last Sunday to this Sat.. prev week same period was -0.18
    I wonder if it will continue and as bcnich said.. will catch people by surprise when house prices actually start falling when it doesnt seem like they should.
    Is there another place where I can see volumes to see if their claim on “low volumes” is still true??

      • its from this link someone posted
        From what I can gather it is the data posted below, the numbers match up..

        I am keen to see this week’s weekly numbers and monthly ones… and how far off the aggregation of the daily index is off the weekly numbers. I don’t know their calc model is that straight forward, e.g. imagine it to be weighted taking into account volumes of each day during the week.

        As an example, https://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2020/05/corelogic-weekly-house-price-update-falls-steepen/ shows Sydney to 21/05 is -0.12 weekly. But looking at daily data, it was down -0.21 if you aggregate it, so it is nearly -0.09 different. And month to date, they said -0.05 and daily aggregate was -0.08.

        So yeah, basically daily is showing a greater deterioration in index values than the weekly/monthly numbers.
        If I had the auto-magic means to do it, I’d see if there were similar/larger/smaller variations between the daily aggregate and the weekly/monthly series when prices were going up even with larger volumes….

    • well there was a period of low volumes where prices were still heading north and they did not seem to have an issue with that. But pulled the index down the moment prices started to fall across the board.
      Those jokers credibility is gone. I was using it as Corruption Index.. was giving me good idea how rotten the system is and how low people are prepared to go in order to make money out of another fool.

  22. reusachtigeMEMBER

    Anecdata from the Sydney investor property market… It’s hot! We can all feel that the new boom times have arrived, almost. This is the last chance to pick up some heavily discounted bargains. Some are at least .5-.75% under fair value!

      • The Traveling Wilbur

        Free doms? Where?!

        Oh… well… maybe you’ll like my letter to Spenthouse further up the page. Reply to MiBo.

    • The Traveling Wilbur

      Now, now. All of us enlightened cuddly-bumbfluffs aren’t supposed to wish ill on anyone these days – no matter how fitting the outcome might be.

      Not without using the ‘.’ protocol afterwards. 😇

  23. no one cares about covid19 anymore

    yesterdays news, the streets here are packed, cant get a park anymore, everyone is crowded around each other

    • SnappedUpSavvyMEMBER

      I’d like to visit Dubbs again, go to the zoo, and Coonabarabran, climb the bread knife and have dinner in the awesomely ostentatious Chinese restaurant

      Last time I was in Coonabarabran me and the wife went for a walk/jog after being in the car all day and got chased down the street by commodore with 4 pissed country boys hanging out of it hurling incomprehensible quantities of abuse and then they fcked off, while we went straight back to the motel hotel 😆

      • Some idiot in NSW Parks decided to pave the tracks in the Warrambunguls like a bloody shopping mall.

        • SnappedUpSavvyMEMBER

          That’s a shame, it felt very remote 6 or so years ago, actually I remember now climbing it when the track up was just rocks, before the staircases went in, felt like summiting Everest in a t shirt

    • Sounds like the yellow man manufactured a racist virus to kill the wh1te devil.

  24. How do I find unreported sales prices for a suburb in Qld? Is there a central website or data agency?? Sick of agents not reporting sales prices

  25. got warned by some indian mall security guard this afternoon

    he apparently has video footage of me taking bottles from the mall aisle trash cans despite repeated warnings for me not to come back

    “you’re in our system mate”

    i was like “creepy dude”

    Lmao Y would he care

    • reusachtigeMEMBER

      He’s Indian. He wants a cut. You need to offer. What’s 20% of $7.45?

      • lol. Also, if he doesn’t get a cut out of it, you’re not getting it either.
        Dad joke I remember from when I lived at parent’s –
        Jail cells in India don’t need locks. Why? Because one Indian wouldn’t let another Indian succeed in getting out. So no need for locks.
        But off course, it’s racist for anyone else to say the same.

        • Know IdeaMEMBER


          If we can’t have a genuine laugh at aspects of all cultures, including our own, where are we heading? How can incongruity have a racial or cultural monopoly?

  26. reusachtigeMEMBER

    If you are under the age of 40 and have supported the lock downs that have destroyed your livelihood so that the old cunce can continue their life of luxury you are the poster-child of the sucker generation that you really are! Stupid fools!!!

  27. I am a doctor and I am appalled that people that went to tafe to learn a trade have opinions!!! I have no idea of their level of intelligence, but surely someone of high grade intelligence would never choose to work a trade with the filthy unwashed. And while I’m at it, Murica Murica Murica, conspiracy ,TDS, you all crazy and how dare you talk about gardening and booze and if I had a membership I wouldn’t renew it.

    For feck sake there’s some deadest tossers in Australia these days and surprise surprise they’re not immigrants. Vote PHON yeah baby.

    This comment was bought to you by george dickel 12 yr old, cask wine, coopers XPA cans and a solitary but glorious Melbourne Bitter longneck and a bag full of annoyance at a select few posters. As usual my disclaimer – I can be guilty of these things too, but y’all take the cake. And while I’m at it, eat a bag of wangs mig

  28. reusachtigeMEMBER

    Have you horded enough ham-flavoured baked beans to deprive old people of their favourite smoked pork-like tasty snack? I hope so. Provide recipe ideas for 5000 serves.

    • GunnamattaMEMBER

      woweee, I can see it right now, draped over freshly buttered slabs of toast, with two poached eggs some mushrooms and cracked pepper over the lot – with two long blacks.

      Man, come the great intercontinental ballistic urban redevelopment exchange I wanna be doing breakfast at your house brother. In the shelter, with the beans.

  29. haroldusMEMBER

    Also, if we have learnt any one lesson today, it is this:

    Interminable quoting of statistics and rehashing grievances far outweighs in importance any chat of gardens, or wine, or anyone stirring with a first.

    Especially on weekend links!

    • I think we’re in a living experiment a la Matthew Island. Instead of reindeer MB’s got shut-ins and due to all the lockdowns MB’s peak shut-in population has been exceeded. The stresses within the community are now obvious, a population crash is inevitable. The reindeer population on Matthew Is exploded out to 6,000 and then collapsed to 42 (yes, that really was the question). Who knows how many shut-ins will make it through. Well, reusa of course, but who else?

      PS also, another example of how bubbles don’t deflate, they explode.

  30. Untersberg Mountain


    The man who crashed his car into a western Sydney hijab shop will remain behind bars after police raised concerns about a “very similar” incident earlier in the year.

    Sabry Moustafa Nassa, 51, was denied bail when he appeared at Parramatta Bail Court on Saturday morning after prosecutors raised fears for the community and the risk of a repeat incident.

    Ah the benefits of immigration!

    So, how many migration visa points do you get for being able to do a standing burnout 2 cars back at the traffic lights? This bloke was so good, he could do it in his sleep. Australia was always on winner importing this punter!


    The lawyer for the man who crashed into a western Sydney hijab shop says his client was unconscious during the incident and denied he deliberately drove into the store.

    • reusachtigeMEMBER

      You gotta wish the dude was a n1gger so we could hate him even more! I’m glad bogans never do this sick sh1t! (By the way, my slight racialist slant is extreme hate for fat wh1te bogan chicks – they totally represent sh1te, except it’s wh1te coloured and not brown, like dried dog sh1t.)

        • reusachtigeMEMBER

          I only do hot ch1cks, which means mainly Asian working girls or relations party property investors (often also Asian working girls). Those typically obese bogan ch1cks need to find blokes doing burnouts, they’ll take anything that breaths in the back seat, like Gavvy and his combustion engines!

  31. reusachtigeMEMBER

    I am SO getting SICK of this “hey young people you aren’t invincible” propaganda going down in the media. Earth to young people, in the case of this virus, you are almost certainly invincible with very rare exceptions. T

    people writing and choreographing this bullsh1t are old people threatened by your virility. Live your life, do what young people are meant to do and rebel and fight, and overall – fck them (but not in the literal sense because they are past their prime and now extremely unattractive)!

  32. I know a lot of uncertainty, and angst, arises from people having limited time to fact-check information posted on forums such as this. I make no particular claim to certainty regarding Covid-19 in any respect. It is a “novel” coronavirus, after all.

    I prefer to spend my time having a punt and drinking wine, but occasionally my curiosity is piqued.
    Coming makes a claim to being a doctor. Would his handy go-to reference for certainty on fatality rates be a site such as Medrvix?


    medRxiv (pronounced “med-archive”) is a free online archive and distribution server for complete but unpublished manuscripts (preprints) in the medical, clinical, and related health sciences. Preprints are preliminary reports of work that have not been certified by peer review. They should not be relied on to guide clinical practice or health-related behavior and should not be reported in news media as established information.

    It is not always helpful to have a flood of opinion based on preliminary data https://www.healthnewsreview.org/2020/04/strong-caveats-are-lacking-as-news-stories-trumpet-preliminary-covid-19-research/

    There are circa 800 papers relating to Covid-19 alone on Medrvix. To make the point about cherry-picking data that suits your narrative, I present a paper from the same source that indicates IFR of 1.29%.


    You can even find some nit-picking in comments at the bottom of the article that Coming linked to.

    Anyway, I take claims on any internet forum with the required grain of salt. Coming says he is a doctor. I could care less except if he were treating me. It seems just as likely to me, as a not-doctor, that there may be a case, somewhere (whistling while looking at a distant object), of psychosis involving grandiose delusions (I’m a doctor, you know; only I was correct about “thing”), with a side-serve of persecutory complex (MB is singling me out), and more than a hint of a concomitant dismissive attitude to others (you’re all stupid; you’re not a doctor – I’m a doctor).

    But hey! I’m just a random on the net, so my opinions are the same as any other poster.