Weekend Reading: 11-12 August 2018

Global Macro / Markets / Investing:

Americas:

Europe:

Asia:

Trans-Tasman:

Comments

  1. Hello Harry!

    This is one of my simple pleasures. To deny haroldus a simple pleasure. What else would a simple man want?

    A house, perchance? No, no quash that dream of the elites. Stick to simple pleasures…. and avocado toast!

  2. A2 picked it up in macro afternoon, but how about Turkey. It’s in some deep shiz lol. Biji Kurdistan

    • Erdogan saying “buy lira” is possibly the greatest contrarian indicator of the year.

      Makes it completely clear he has no plan and the Turks, being smart people actually, have promptly done the opposite with both hands.

      • Perhaps Mr Trump is delivering on one of his Helsinki agreements (??). It wasn’t that long ago that Russia and Turkey were cranky at each other but in recent months the relationship has been warming. The prize for Russia of course is control of the Black Sea and much of the eastern Mediterranean Sea and would give Russia a swathe of allies through the Middle East (from Iran, Iraq, Syria and possibly Turkey).

        By Mr Trump so obviously taking advantage of Turkey in its moment of weakness he surely has turned Erdogan away from NATO / Europe and towards Uncle Vlad.

        https://www.axios.com/worsening-usturkey-relations-are-a-boon-to-russia-8ebcf7d4-1515-44e0-b550-52c1bd00dcd9.html

      • I presume the result will be bye bye Erdogan… can’t imagjne the Turks think things are going well … Turkey is usually an astute player but Erdogan has clearly developed a five star case of dictatorship hubris.

      • A2,

        I think you’re going to be disappointed, I doubt they’ll blame him, Trump will wear it.

    • Turkey was always going to be a casualty. It is amazing that they got as far as they did. Edorgian’s rubbish economic decision making (keeping lira rates too low) given big USD and Euro borrowings finally sank the currency.

      Trump is a sideshow in all of this.

  3. Worth sharing this 1… Why? Because this couple are just like every other naive Millenial who thinks they can fix the world’s problems with understanding and hugs and Instagram photos and “experiences”. The sad irony is that for all the good (and yes I agree there is a lot of good people) it just takes 1 f$ck stain to ruin everything. My brother and his partner are on a world trip like this right now and he’s a total apologist for the Sudanese Gangs in Melbourne. I love to wind him up. But the reason is, that I’m a realist. I too used to drink the koolaid that all we all need is love and racism is evil and blah blah blah. But then I travelled and saw parts of the world that were a complete mess, they can’t be fixed they are that broken and corrupt. Best leave those problems and cultures to their own destructive devices. We cannot help everyone and nor is it our job to do so.

    https://www.smh.com.au/world/middle-east/love-filled-their-trip-but-on-day-369-isis-struck-20180809-p4zwku.html

      • boomengineeringMEMBER

        Hey Gav, got banned from Visy at Smithfeild shutdowns by an Indian boss when I said the Gov’t shouldn’t let illegal immigrants into this country after seeing the situation first hand at Lihir Island where the best life expectancy of the natives is 33yo, most die before 30yo from unknown diseases .

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Or perhaps HG Wells provides a better description of this couples naivety with his Eloi and Morlocks .

      “By the year AD 802,701, humanity has evolved into two separate species: the Eloi and the Morlocks. The Eloi live a banal life of ease on the surface of the earth, while the Morlocks live underground, tending machinery and providing food, clothing, and inventory for the Eloi. The narration suggests that the separation of species may have been the result of a widening split between different social classes. Having solved all problems that required strength, intelligence, or virtue, the Eloi have slowly become dissolute and naive:

      They do not perform much work, except to feed, play, and mate;

      The Eloi are technically adept but don’t understand the technology; they regress and unlearn millennia of culture, thought and reason, until they are satisfied with the pleasure of merely existing.”

      Now the Morlocks on the other hand,….

    • Too right it’s not our job to solve the worlds problems. I don’t mind letting in minimal immigration intake but if you dont embrace and comply with our values, lifestyle and law then the whole family should be deported after no more than one crime committed no matter how menial. Most of the snowflakes here don’t want to really help the world anyway they are fake. A friends gf just got back from Africa recently after volunteering in an orphanage. It’s all for show and tell, we have so many problems here at home I asked her why dont you volunteer here? Many homeless youth here too. I have volunteered as a surf lifeguard for many years and have rescued a handful of people from drowning. Doesn’t have the wow factor and instagram moments these snowflakes crave.

      • boomengineeringMEMBER

        Dan agreed, have you noticed that the greens Et al, do gooders, always expect other people to do their good intentions. Had some problems with them 30yrs ago and noticed them complaining about the effluent that they themselves created and driving around in the Kombi spewing smoke. Similar story with proponents of mass immigration you don’t see them volunteering to house them at their home. Yep did years of voluntary work for PBC’s, ANBB and other (political party). Rather give direct than through taxes and bureaucracy.

      • I know I know don’t get me started, this fires me right up just as much as an episode of QandA does!

      • I often wonder about those sorts of trips why the locals don’t work at the orphanage instead. If the locals knew how much your friend paid to travel all the way from Australia they may just have requested a donation.

    • Lol “Sudanese gangs”. No matter how many ripts in Torquay by white surfie kids, coward punchings in Dandenong by “top boke” white concretors or numerous other acts of violence that occur in Melbourne (and are reported by the same paper) its “Da Sudanese” according to people who’ve never even met them

    • The difference, Gav, is that you think it’s nature and other people think it’s nurture.

      • So presumably if we import enough of the nurtured stuff we get to nurture more conflict here. Reassuring.

      • You’ll have to expand on that. I’ve got a busy weekend and quite frankly CBF deciphering what you’re trying to say.

      • The difference smithy, is you pretend that its only nurture due to retarded left wing religious dogma, and the rest of us get to pick up the tab, in money, broken lives, and bodies, for your convenient delusion.

        Anyone with a modicum of sense knows it is both nature and nurture. But it is oh so convenient for the left to import large numbers of criminals, not least because those criminals vote left.

    • Radical Islam is an invention of the Empire. Brezsinski (may he rot in hell) gloated about the face they lured the USSR into Afghanistan by crating “stirred up Moslems”. Those became the Taliban. Isis is a child of Hillary Clinton and Israel.

      South Sudan, by the way, is also a Hillary/Obama mess. So you can thank them for the Sudanese kids in Melbourne.

      Got to know who your enemy is.

    • A few yrs back in Perth there was monthly troubles with parties when they were gate crashed requiring the riot police to attend. At no stage was it reported as “White Australians riot at out of control party”.

      Your claims of no assimilation, no stay are the same twaddle that was bandied around in the 60s and 70s over southern european migration, yet here we are and not a word mentioned about how they were received back them, all glossed over (mainly).

      • Dennis, why don’t you go and live in Sudan or any African country?
        The multiracial society won’t work, hasn’t worked and will never work.
        There are no ‘Garden of Eden’ multiracial nations in the world and there will never be any.
        However there will be great social unrest, if the West, led by the unholy union of the ‘multicultural’ Left and the globalist economic Right, are allowed to continue to foist their ruinous ideology on the people

        https://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/police-admit-sudanese-44-times-more-likely-to-break-law/news-story/8ca308022ba8fbbc4b89ed50504271c5

      • Dennis – the southern Europeans are a white caucasian people, immigrating into a country of white caucasian northern European people, so no surprises regarding integration there.

      • Patrick this comment “Dennis – the southern Europeans are a white caucasian people, immigrating into a country of white caucasian northern European people, so no surprises regarding integration there.” is the funniest comment on southern european immigration I have heard and indicates either you have no idea what you’re talking about, or must be very young and ignorant of what transpired with said immigration here in the late 50s to the late 70s.

        For starters they were not viewed as “white” and were called wogs, dagos etc and the same claims about assimilation were made. It didn’t matter that they were Catholic, they weren’t liked and were on the receiving end of a lot of racism about their lack of English, food and dress etc. It wasn’t until into the 80s that this started to fall away. In the late 70s into the early 80s it was the Vietnamese boat people who started to replace them for “special treatment”. Same claims, the same story. Today is no different.

        Btw, we were not a country of northern european people, we were predominately of UK descent, and that was still how Australians viewed themselves then. Your northern europeans like the Germans were not well treated either throughout the early to late 1900s.

        The biggest difference then was that immigration had bipartisan political support and the media never supported what was a common ill feeling towards the immigrants.

  4. The 500 km/h maglev line in Japan.

    It is slated to be built by 2027 and cost U$49-80 billion. But that is how much AUS spends on negative gearing handouts every decade.

    Unfortunately, 85% of the 286 km route will be in a tunnel.

    Henrik Sylvan believes that the construction of maglev track systems need not be as expensive as the Japanese example, where the tunnels are a massive part of the total cost.

    https://singularityhub.com/2018/08/01/are-maglev-trains-the-ultra-fast-levitating-transit-system-of-the-future/

    They plan to extend the line by 152 km to reach Osaka. This is in a nation that has a shrinking population!

    Globalists in Australia say “get immigrants to live in rural areas”. But Japanese people are still moving to Tokyo:

    Tokyo and its surrounding areas marked the 19th consecutive year of net population increase in 2014, as 110,000 more people moved into the area than moved out.

    Either due to a tax arrangement or it is simply more efficient to live in a city.

    • St JacquesMEMBER

      While it was convenient “flying” around France and Spain in high speed trains, I still prefer the over-nighters with bunks. Years ago I met a businessman based in Sydney who came down to Hellbourne on a regular basis. He preferred to take the over-night train, sleep, wake, freshen up, have breakfast, watch the scenery and get out out in a central city station in the morning, in a relaxed state of mind.

    • St JacquesMEMBER

      Just as bigger is not always better, (ie Switzerland v India), faster is not always better. The overnight sleeper services between Syd-Mel and Syd-Bris still exist, and though not cheap, they are competitive if they save you a night in a hotel and you value facing your work day fresh and relaxed. They are a very under-rated service and people should give them a try. The high speed trains make sense given the typical distances they are used for between major cities in Europe and Asia, which are short by our standards.

    • I went of the Shanghai maglev and the noise at startup was crazy. The other crazy thing was getting back to the airport via the train and being in that underground station trying to get to the ticket office. We could probably have done it another way, but it was scary in a crushed sea of people and not being able to speak Mandarin.

      • Unfortunately the Shanghai Maglev is now restricted to a top speed of 300Km/h it used to reach a top speed of 431km/h…now that was fast, especially if you were on the ground. At 431km/h you’d see it coming but hear nothing until it was right on top of you and then it was like a loud boom followed by a quick doppler shifted trailing off sound.
        I did a junior high science experiment with my son where we recorded the sound of the Maglev inside the maglev and outside at the location where it was travelling at top speed. we then tried to use Doppler shift to measure the speed, it was interesting that the approaching sound was useless for doppler shift (still not sure why but it was probably to do with nonlinear acoustics caused by the leading edge compression wave, hence the boom sound ), however the trailing sound frequency shift was spot on at 431km/h.

      • @fisho… I went on it in March 2011 and we were doing 380 I think. I have a photo on one of my old phones. Agree that once at speed , inside at least, it was quiet. Interesting project. When we were developing Layer1 for GSM (including the DSP modem part of the chip) the freq/time tracking had to worked out so that the tx/rx bursts were transmitted and received to be able to be modulated de-modulated correctly. You also need the timing advance to be adjusted appropriately. Plus all the cell handover types needed to work at those high speeds. The low speed stuff we did on Belgium trains, but the fun one was to test on the French TGV. We knew from all the lab testing it’d work, but you never know when there are a whole range of infra from different vendors if it will work 100%.

    • I would rather build smaller cheap rails / tunnels with simple brushed tracks to deliver power to autonomous vehicles. Car just rolls up to the system and you are take to Sydney without having to get out of your car or even wake up.

      No need for tracks or trains or anything.

      Instead of building $50 Billion on trains you could simply purchase a million or more autonomous electric vehicles to drive us around. Build them here – problem solved of all mass transit and public roads, congestion, freeway and infrastructure over night.

      Whats more – batteries can be sent to power industrial, commercial and retail operations during the day wherever they are needed while people are at work – incredible.

  5. NEW ZEALAND: Foreigners face ban on buying homes in New Zealand … UK Telegraph

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2018/08/10/foreigners-face-ban-buying-homes-new-zealand-apocalypse-bolthole/

    … extract …

    … But the country’s centre-left government, led by Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern, is blaming the apocalypse preppers for a major housing crisis in the country, with rates of homelessness among the highest in the developed world.

    Ms. Ardern’s Labour party is adamant that a law change banning foreigners from buying most types of homes in the country – due to pass in parliament next week – will help damp down property prices, along with their plans to build 100,000 affordable housing units in a decade, resolve New Zealand’s zoning and infrastructure woes, and bolster its ailing construction industry.

    The bill banning foreign buyers has been reeled in from an earlier, stricter, version, and will now allow foreigners to buy new apartments in large developments and multi-storey blocks. Existing homes remain off limits to non-residents, but people from Australia and Singapore will be exempt from the ban, due to free trade rules. … read more via hyperlink above …
    .
    .
    Reality check for Ministers (really some … just some … asleep enviros) at environment conference | Politik

    http://politik.co.nz/en/content/Environment/1400/Reality-check-for-Ministers-at-environment-conference-Environmental-Defence-Society-Gary-Taylor-Phil-Twyford-David-Parker-RMA.htm

    … extract …

    … Attendees probably left last night with more questions than when they arrived as Ministers, who in Opposition had seemed sympathetic to environmental issues were left qualifying and modifying their stance on major issues.

    This was starkly evident in an exchange between Urban Development Minister, Phil Twyford, and the EDS CEO, Gary Taylor over urban sprawl.

    Twyford had set out an impassioned description of the impact of high house prices in Auckland and advocated the linking together of transport and other infrastructure and new housing developments.

    But he also advocated the scrapping or urban-rural limits.

    “We believe that we have to manage growth on the fringes of the city,” he said.

    “If we do not allow new land to come into the supply we will never ever fix the problem of absurdly expensive urban land.

    “With good investment in infrastructure and transport, with more planning, not less to create the future urban environment that we want, setting aside areas of special value and open spaces, acquiring land for transport and other infrastructure, if we then allow the city to grow we will bring down urban land prices and it is absolutely critical that we do,” he said.

    Twyford had proposed this when he was in Opposition but, even so, any suggestion that more rural land was going to be absorbed for housing was going to be controversial at an environmental conference.

    And Taylor was quick to respond.

    “Everything makes sense except I worry about why you need to do away with rural-urban boundaries altogether,” said Taylor.

    He said that giving free reign to developers seemed inconsistent with Twyford’s overall objective of having a compact city.

    Twyford replied that it was a question of values.

    “This is for us, for Labour, for our coalition government, this is fundamentally a social justice issue.

    “Our objective is not to build a Copenhagen of the South Pacific.

    “We could build a beautiful city with a whole lot of the policies we have talked about.

    “We could build a Vancouver of the South Pacific; beautiful but utterly unaffordable.

    “I’m interested in us fixing this totally dysfunctional urban land economy.

    “If we don’t deal with affordability we will have completely wasted the opportunity that has been given to our generation.”

    Twyford said the only way to deal with the affordability issue was to deal with the land price issue and that meant dealing with the artificial scarcity of land caused by the planning system and the availability of finance for infrastructure.

    However he didn’t dispute that the Auckland region was going to become more heavily built up.

    “You know what,” he said. “In two or three generations this is going to become a tri-city conurbation between Hamilton, Tauranga and Auckland whether we like it or not.” … read more via hyperlink above …

    … further reading …

    http://www.performanceurbanplanning.org/

    • … UPDATE … CHRISTCHURCH CENTRAL …

      NOW … North Island investor exiting … 16 units individually for sale … Salisbury Street, Christchurch … Harcourts agents …

      http://harcourts.co.nz/Property/Residential?pageid=-1&search=&formsearch=true&OriginalTermText=&OriginalLocation=1419&location=1419&proptype=13&min=&max=&minbed=&maxbed=&sold=false
      April total property auction … Colliers agent …

      http://www.colliers.co.nz/news/2017/some%20of%20the%20first%20post-quake%20christchurch%20townhouses%20for%20sale/

      What happened at the April auction ? …

      Investors / speculators exiting … new owner occupiers emerging ?
      .
      .
      … CHRISTCHURCH NZ … HOUSE PRICES SINK … SPECULATORS FLEE …

      ‘Severely unaffordable’ Christchurch NZ ( 5.4 Median Multiple … Demographia Survey … http://www.demographia.com ) prices sink as speculators ( investors ? ) flee … due to sustained new housing production …

      … Ignore inappropriate title … focus on CoreLogic suburban price and price trends graphs …

      Christchurch house prices may pick up as city buyers enjoy most affordable market in more than a decade | Stuff.co.nz

      https://i.stuff.co.nz/the-press/105774354/christchurch-house-prices-may-pick-up-as-city-buyers-enjoy-most-affordable-market-in-more-than-a-decade

      • Sydney one of world’s most ‘overvalued’ cities: The Economist … The New Daily

        https://thenewdaily.com.au/money/property/2018/08/10/global-house-price-index-sydney/

        Sydney is one of the world’s most “overvalued” cities, according to a new global house-price index, but declining property prices mean that could be set to change.

        In its annual global house-price index London-based news magazineThe Economist compared residential property prices in the world’s most popular cities against each city’s median household income.

        According to The Economist, post-global-financial-crisis property price booms that occurred in many famous metropolises, including Sydney, are “unsustainable” when compared to household incomes. … read more via hyperlink above …
        .
        .
        (New South Wales Premier) Gladys Berejiklian ‘extremely comfortable’ with falling Sydney house prices | afr.com
        … behind paywall …

        https://www.afr.com/real-estate/gladys-berejiklian-extremely-comfortable-with-falling-sydney-house-prices-20180724-h132q8

        NSW Premier Gladys Berejiklian is “extremely comfortable” with where house prices in Sydney have gone and expects the recent slide in Sydney house prices is a welcome turn of events for those trying to break into the market. … read more via hyperlink above …
        .
        .
        … Detached housing … artificial bubble generated apartment stock excluded …

        2018 14th Annual Demographia International Housing Affordability Survey (pdf)

        http://www.demographia.com/dhi.pdf

    • It will fail. The foreign buyers will just buy via an onshore NZ proxy. Same as here.
      NZ will now waste tens billions in political gestures of low cost affordable housing.
      And it will all be gobbled up by foreign cash to be used in housing transient migrants, pending their residency & citizenship grant to enter Australia.

      Same as the FHB & NRAS or NG schemes here.
      All heavily exploited by the foreign syndicates & onshore proxies / dirty money – to house renters.
      As long as the average transient : temporary migrant renter occupancy is twice or more normal NZ usage – in renter occupancy & cash flow – a large chunk being sub let cash no tax flow income, then that will win & drive both the ownership investor and tenant base.

      NZ is just a transit stop for migrants into Australia.
      It takes a while as they work illegally etc in repayment of their agent procurers and so Auckland etc has become a ‘mini me’ of Sydney & Melbourne in exactly the same Housing bubble, accomodation crisis, and very high transient migrant concentration.

      In NZ, like here, the structural impact in NZ has been the foreign & proxy acquisition of over 80,000 modest established units & small modest suburban houses to be run as investment properties housing migrant ‘foreign students’ & sponsored migrant guestworkers.
      Wiped out NZ born affordable housing. Put all other NZ into mortgage indebtedness based on valuations now way out of whack with normal occupancy or utility.

      The migrants then apply for NZ residency stamps & citizenship. Only need one family member as a citizen and all the rest can enter Australia on ‘family extension’

      Once they have that – then into Australia on a SCV.
      95% one way flow.

      In Australia we now have 2.2 million TR, 74% third world origin including the NZ SCV foreign born subset) and 87% unskilled.
      Over 450,000 modest Australian dwellings acquired by foreign syndicates & onshore proxies now house this 2.7 million migrant guestworkers – average 6 per dwelling, twice normal occupancy but than half the rental income declared (only the legal or usual rent not the cash in hand sublet). A $24 billion racket with $10 billion neve declared. Plus billions in FHB, NRAS & NG as subsidy)
      -/-
      Only way to fix NZ housing issue is same as here.
      The migrant Guestworkers & associated housing demand. Which in NZ case is driven by the SCV access into Australia (NZ back door).
      ➡️ Remove the underlying nutrient.

      NZ to Australia migrant trade. SCV intake.
      We have 650,000 NZ SCV.
      In 2008 only 11% were foreign born – mostly Pacific Islanders or Fiji Indians.
      In 2017 233,000 or 32% are foreign born – mostly Chinese & Indians. Older NZ born are going back, offset by a massive 95% one way flow from NZ to Australia of non NZ born coming in via the back door SCV. NZ recently tightened up their transitory migrant intake (students, sponsored etc) but has a large onshore pool of third world unskllled allowed in under NZ previously lax & totally open migrant policy.

      Backlog.
      There are 250,000 non NZ born queued up in NZ pending citizen grants (only one needs the citizen grant to get a SCV into Australia, the rest of their family parents children & relatives can come in on family extension) waiting to get in.

      Winston Peters promised to fix it.
      “NZ only sells two things, milk powder to the Chinese & NZ passport stamps to get into Australia”.

      “We should apologise to Australia for the damage we have done”

      Peters held the balance of power & choice of government.
      He knows the ‘restrictions’ on foreign acquisition of NZ housing will have little or no impact, given the huge amount of non NZ born proxies in NZ who will act for the foreign criminal syndicates or run their own onshore rackets.

      ➡️ Winston Peters needs to fix the real issue.
      🔹The NZ – Aust SCV only for Australian or NZ born,

      That shuts down the intake into NZ
      Stops the backlog getting into Australia.
      Helps normalise housing in both countries.
      And ideally the quarter of a million non NZ born already here have their work rights removed & sent back to NZ.

  6. @ErmingtonPlumber, I posted this the other day but I suspect you didn’t see it.
    If you don’t have any opinion that’s fine, I’m just baffled by the advice registered plumbers are giving elderly clients.
    Hi EP if you’re available I’d like your thoughts on residential Water heaters.
    Too be up front and honest with you, I have my own opinions on what is the optimal given solar/PV costs however I keep seeing people especially elderly that are advised by their plumbers to put in the biggest off-peak water heater that will fit. Logic is…you never want to run out of hot water…do you?
    The stupidity of this approach is that these huge water heaters often consume over 7Kwh of electricity per day just to keep the water at regulated temperature. These elderly couples are often only showering once or twice a week and wouldn’t actually even use 7Kwh per week worth of hot water.
    This represents a tremendous waste of energy (and is a huge part of their total carbon footprint) but it’s also a huge and unnecessary expense …all delivered courtesy of their local plumbers best advice.
    Why are local plumbers advising the elderly to buy these over sized Off-peak water heaters when what they really need is a much smaller capacity on-demand water heater?

    Worse still are the Off-peak water heaters with supplemental PV solar, these are normally configured to heat the water each night to the regulated temperature so that in effect it’s only the hot water used during the morning that is replenished with PV solar, if you shower in the evenings than practically all the water heating is actually from Off-Peak electricity. Why are plumbers configuring these systems like this?
    Are there any industry guide lines on how to optimally address water heating options especially wrt total energy footprint?

    • GunnamattaMEMBER

      I have a couple of questions vis solar hot water too for anyone who may know.

      I have 5kw of solar on my roof – no battery. I have small ongoing electricity bills, of which probably more than half is actually the service charge to have power to the place. I also have a gas hot water system which is about 5 years old and has another 5 of reliable life in it. It is the only thing I use gas for, and of course the service charge from the gas is more than half my gas bill. My gas and electricity bill is with AGL. I am not on a contract (so I can leave at anytime) but that means I get the extortion rate of charge.

      I am looking to go battery fairly soon. I am looking at solar hot water. The first guys I had around vis solar hot water were touting a rooftop system (so the water gets hot in the roof and gets collected). The next guys I had around were touting a heat pump so that they add a few extra panels to the roof and the electricity generated goes to a heat pump.

      The first guys said heat pumps were finicky, unreliable, and noisy, and that rooftop solar hot water had no problems at all and would last ten years. The second guys i got around said rooftop solar (and they showed me a few places they dealt with often had issues in the rooftop panels which meant they could rust out, issues with frost, and that the heat pump was not much noise at all, with the reliability and duration of a heat pump system given a bad name by dubious quality suppliers in years gone by.

      Anyone got thoughts on the rooftop solar versus rooftop panels supplying a heat pump dynamic – in Geelong. Cheers for any thoughts.

      In case anyone is wondering there will be no chartfest this weekend, i only got back from ACT last night and have a load of other work to do this weekend. But I should be back next week.

      • IMHO for most parts of Australia traditional Solar hot water systems just don’t make any sense any more, but a lot really depends on your available roof area, because Solar Hot water systems are more efficient (Kw/msq than Pv solar) so if you have very little suitable roof area than optimally you should use it for a Traditional solar hot water system.
        For everyone else (typical family that is) with sufficient roof area (receiving sub 10c/kwh FIT) it makes more sense to use an electric storage hot water system powered by your excess PV solar, with supplemental in line boost (for this gas systems seem to work the best). The lowest total cost (in warmer areas) is usually to have LPG as the gas boost and PV Solar as the primary hot water source. In colder areas Natural gas is typically already hooked up and used for residential heating so it makes more sense to use the NG for supplemental water heating.
        The main reason for configuring a system this way is that you have greater flexibility on how you use the power you generate. In summer hot water is not usually an issue so the power you don’t use heating water is probably best exported or use for cooling, with a traditional hot water system all you get is LOT’s of hot water in summer and not enough in winter, which is sort of the opposite to the typical use profile.

      • Gunna, take a look at the greentech forum at whirlpool. There is a lot of idiots on that site, but the green tech forum has some knowledgable posters. From what I recall, heatpumps are generally not such a good payoff as the reliable ones are so expensive. My folks had solar hws on roof, but it was just panels that feed a gravity hws in the ceiling, with a booster element manually turned on. Worked well. A mains pressure one on the roof, i dont think is such a good thing these days. The pick would probably be electric with the element on a relay from the inverter with over ride.

      • Did a bit of reading on this a couple of weeks back, Gunna, after I got a semi-spam email suggesting a heat pump was a great way to efficiently turn sunlight into hot water.

        My conclusion was that while this is technically true, when you live in sunny QLD like me, a good old fashion on-roof solar hot water system is best. It’s not as efficient, but it’s a lot simpler technology and hence more reliable and cheaper over the long term.

        Heat pumps might be better down where you are. They are a lot more complex (basically a fridge) and consequently likely to be less reliable thought.

        It’s a shame gas has gotten so expensive. Instant-on gas systems are probably the most energy efficient overall.

      • I have a 5kW solar system like you (in Melbourne) and installed a heat pump hot water system about 4 years ago. I have no complaints about it whatsoever. It’s a Sanden brand system which is a very reputable Japanese brand. It turns on at 10am every day once the solar panels are in full swing and there’s often no other electricity consumption. It uses 3-4 kWh per day for a family of four. It is virtually inaudible.
        I’m currently trying to get AGL to disconnect my gas but they seem to be having immense difficulty understanding my request and keep treating my request as a change of house owner situation and sending new accounts. I suspect it’s a deliberate attempt to try to stop people leaving the gas network.

      • Check out solarquotes.com.au Lots of good advice on that site. You can also pose specific questions to them that they will likely take some pains to provide a considered and detailed answer. Btw: they claim that for domestic 5kw systems it is generally not cost effective to install a battery backup as of now.

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Customer management (not having your time wasted) is a big part of what advice is served.
      Many are fully focused on up front cost, unable or not wanting to wait 4, 5 or 6 years (or more) to recoup the difference between a kettle like element heater changeover, costing around $1200 – $1600, compared to a solar setup that can cost over 5k.
      As for plumbers not recomending smaller heaters for pensioners,…a “same for same” changeover (size and brand) involves the lowest labor cost,…no stuffing around with pipe work, literally in and out in around an hour (more time soent draining the tank than doing the actual job).
      As a one man band with few overheads, I simply put $500 on my materials cost (heater, tempering valve, fittings etc) and win most of my HW enquiries, if I am beaten on price, its usually only just, to one of the specialist HW companies that buy their heaters wholesale for 100s of dollars cheaper than I can get them.
      They have their own trucks that come and deliver the heater and take the old one away and run very efficient opperations,…one of their employees could be changing out up to 6 or 7 heaters per day.
      These companies are extremely expensive though when it comes to any kind of pipework change, relocation or different kind of hot water system.
      They almost never quote the required tempering valve requirement (supposed to be changed every 5 years but never are unless failing) and are always hitting up the customer for another couple of hundred after winning the job.

      I have fitted smaller heaters for off peak using clients a number of times, replacing a 315 or 400 litre heater with a 250l one but only for really price sensitive clients like 2 pensioners living alone,…I always ask about visitor stayovers, numbers usage patterns etc a 250 is to small on off peak for 4 people.
      I had one crusty older guy in his late 60s who spends half his time riding motorcycles around the country, insist I install a cheap 80 or 125 L HWH on his off peak, telling me he only showers a few times a week and lives alone,…..So under protest I put in a 125 for him,….only saved him 100 bucks.
      The next owners wont be impressed.

      Remember that we plumbers make our money from Doing the job,…not offering a consulting service.
      Large families with heavy HW usage are better of in the long run, spending extra up front solar/ instantaneous gas boosted.
      But why would the pensioner that I recently changed over a 400 for a 315 for themselves and their single mum daughter and child and have a $90/quarter off peak electricity bill (from their old 400l HWH ! They showed me their bill) Want to spend 5 or 6 grand more for “efficency” of a solar gas boosted system.
      Ive actually got a good friend with 3 daudhters a son him and his wife along with an international student half the time and he gets by with a 315l off peak system that I also changed over from a 400l,…only runs out of HW a couple of times per year,..their property does have very low rate of water flow though, so a similar sized family might no cope with his set up in a higher flow house,…it makes a big difference.
      Much to jacobs approval always remove the flow restrictor from new shower heas installs, but had a recent villa house customer call me back because her teenage daughter was running out all the hot water in their 50l HWH,…it only takes half an hour to heat up again,…but they didn’t run out mid shower with the flow restructor in,….sigh,…like all plumbers I hate call backs, usual don’t get paid for them,…thats why we generally loathe to put in HW heaters that are to small , we get called back when they run out of HW.

      As for heat pumps,…I loath them,…heavy and difficult to install, they are awfully fault prone and because they take so long to heat the water are unsuitable for of peak,…so although they use less electricity to make the water hot,….full time power costs eat up the bill savings when compared to off peak.
      See my detailed contempt for these units here,
      https://www.productreview.com.au/p/rheem-heat-pump.html

      At my place I put in Gas instantaneous and heat and cook with with it as well, but Im pissed off with my increasing Gas bill (the bloody kids spend ages in the shower and the boys not even at wanking age yet!)
      Im going to install solar HW in the next few years, but am undecided on whether to go Gas boosted or off peak element boosted.
      In Sydney where freezing pannells aren’t really a problem, I recomend the, on its side, tank above the pannels where the heated water is moved into the mains pressure tank via convection, ie no pump.
      Like the origional “Solarheart” brand you see everywhere, with a Stainless steel or copper tank, I come across these units still working, that were installed in the 80s!.
      But in colder areas you need to use remote pannels with pumps, sensors, controllers and glycol filled pannels and the heat exchanger pipework in a ground positioned tank.
      I have changed the pump in several Rheem water filled, Roof pannels pumped to ground positioned tank systems,…all were under 7 years old,…the pump is $500 plus my install of around $250 on a unit that cost 1000s more than a simple element heater that’ll give you 12 years trouble free if its vitreous enamel,…or 30 if its Stainless Steel (element thermostat change is only about $150-200 maybe once every 10 years on average)

      Ive been getting a lot of enquiries about instantaneous electric HWH of late but rarely come across them,…the decent units require 3 phase power and most people opt for sonething else.
      Ive only replaced a couple of them with the same (stiebel eltrons)
      My Uncle had an old electro mechanical Hocking electric instantaneous HWH that was installed when the house was built in 1966, he replaced it less than 10 years ago! and only because the bathroom reno guy talked him into it,…it was still working!
      Ive got a similar unit I removed from another job in my garage,…bloody work of art.
      If your super frugal Gunna and live in a cold area the Instantenous electric might be the go,…there widespread in europe, but I don’t know if a battery setup could handle the amps these 12+kw units draw.

      Another thing with solar HW,…Im to old and fat to install them on 2 story houses anymore,…I only ever recomend them on easy access Single story dwellings,…a Plumbers gotta be able to make a quid.

      Anyway there is my 2 bobs worth.

      • GunnamattaMEMBER

        Bloody good value 2 bobs worth.

        I am not that super frugal, indeed I am possibly more profligate that many, who do cost things more effectively and calculate ROI etc. I tend to just think of the joy of not having to have any meaningful interaction with the energy company and go for whatever seems right on the day.

        I wasnt aware of the additional weight on the heat pump, and dont feel the need to agonise for a tad yet – seeing as I can handle the gas bill for the time being though the service charge gets right up my nose. I too have a son of late primary age and who is learning the joys of a lengthier shower. It isnt the power bill which alarms me, but the water bill, which I see climbing alarmingly.

        My frugality tends to take the form of getting out with a chainsaw and doing a drive of the backblocks of the Barwon Valley and bringing it home to burn. It is frugality (redgum or sugar gum being 600 bucks a truckload) but it is also exercise I enjoy.

        Thanks for your thoughts

      • boomengineeringMEMBER

        Maybe a bit extravagant but the missus I and son have 3 water heaters 2 large gas storage inter linked with shut valve between and one small electric storage in workshop .Those winter surfs require bone reheating with semi outside shower, the workshop is too far for the heat to last travelling through the pipe

      • Thanks enormously, I was trying to advise a few friends on what would best suit their needs but I was seeing a lot of reluctance that went something like …A good friend who is a plumber recommended this , so they didn’t want to make any changes.

        I tried to point out that they were spending about $400 / year on electricity to provide very little actual hot water (maybe $50 worth even at peak rates). I guess I wasn’t figuring labour costs and job uncertainty into the equation. As you are saying if it is a simple swap same size units you can do the job in less than an hour and be real happy with yourself if you are installing 3 or 4 systems in a day, however if you try to customize the solution and something unexpected happens you can be there for two days fixing stuff that was never really part of the quoted job and for which the customer is reluctant to pay not understanding why it was even necessary.
        again thank a lot makes a lot of sense what you’re saying…unfortunately it also suggests that real life residential electricity savings will be hard won once the low hanging fruit are harvested.

  7. “What Have We Done?”: Silicon Valley Engineers Fear They’ve Created a Monster

    Lmmao…. homo economicus as deduced by mythologists does not function in the actual world as its proponents believed. Did anyone do limited trials with long enough duration to ascertain the results, no, not when dumb money can only think of riding the event horizon of the next big thing.

    Bit like the last Curtis doco wrt the town blackrock owns in Oregon and its comp farm imo.

    • Interesting back in the 70’s the US was the biggest polluter. No one in the US would listen I expect about climate change and pollution. There are photo’s of aircraft flying into LA and you could see a yellow cloud over the city.

      • During the 80s one could not see a stop sign at the end of the block in Glendale around 2:00 o’clock, not to mention not having much rain outside of the monsoon season the rains washed all the pollution on the ground into the bay when it came. Not to mention even in Rocky National Park up the road from Boulder, CO. the haze is recorded in pictures on a sign between say the 70s to the 90s.

        Even on the beach cars left constantly out side had a pollution cancer on the paint work from the plant in El Segundo.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Segundo,_California#/media/File:El_Segundo,_California_aerial.jpg

      • afund,
        The piece includes quite a bit on that. Change can occur if people what it is proposed to change is tangible. It is affecting them at that point in time so it isn’t hard to get people to want change. Carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases weren’t tangible. And besides, that was a problem for the future.

        When reading the piece the analogy I thought of was saving for retirement. We didn’t do it then, we are now in our late fifties, we’ve still got a monster mortgage, and the credit cards are maxed. Maybe it’s more akin to see are 64, no investments and all our savings just went on a 10% deposit for a house that we shouldn’t have been lent the money for. The point is that we are now at the lotto stage of future planning.

        If we don’t win the technological lotto of figurine out how to geo engineer our way out of this we are done. And who knows what sort of secondary consequences will be if that ever occurs. It’s thought that quantum computing will help us with that but the experts in that field say that we are at least 10 to 20 years from m having the hardwayand software for working on problems of that scale and complexity.

        The Onion captured where we are at and what we can look forward to really well with the below piece.
        https://www.theonion.com/sighing-resigned-climate-scientists-say-to-just-enjoy-1823265249

        On the upside, Stephen Morris’s future of neo-feudalism may be disrupted or derailed.

      • bolstroodMEMBER

        @ Skippy
        1970 in Sydney @ 10 am, sitting in Lady McQuarry’s chair , unable to see the Sydney Harbour Bridge due to brown clouds of pollution. Succumbed to Quincy, left Sydney.

      • @footsore … thanks for the link and I’ll read tonight. I’m a centre of the road type, but heavily believe in not trashing the planet while I’m here. I think all pollies are to blame for where we are, and I can barely bring myself to vote now I’m so sickened buy it all. I’m very comfortable with a reasonable immigration level also, but you can’t even say that now as the forces on all sides go full unsustainable numbers. It’s why I think this country without the infra is going to get even more angry. Let alone where is the water coming from? It’s a really big deal, and our leaders are not up to the challenge. There are even studies saying that we are stuffed as we’re at consuming all the planets resources…probably not true yet, but We seems to be spiralling into the unknown.

      • Check out the opening shots of the original Blues Brothers movie for some amazing industrial air pollution.

      • I can see merit in both arguments. Deregulated capitalism sees all as fuel for profits and cares not about anything else. Climate change was a future problem and we’ll deal with it when we get there. No matter how the blame is proportioned we are still in a whole world of trouble.

  8. Haroldus by the way, have you been to Turkey? (you said you were fascinated).

    Istanbul without doubt one of the most astonishing places in the world. Should be in almost anyone’s Top Three cities in the world for sheer interest. And now their currency is cheap! (Just watch out for riots)

    • GunnamattaMEMBER

      Ditto that. Istanbul is one of the great cities. I lived there for about a year, I have lived in Moscow and London too. Stamboul is the one I regularly think of returning to. Its robust and outdoorsy sometimes, but a life experience in itself. I also happen to like the Turks, although they can be an acquired taste, and like every other nation on the planet have their issues. But good people in my opinion, particularly those from Istanbul, and they are often very positive about Australians.

      • Yes agree with all that. Help the Turks by becoming a good tourist, they do appreciate Good Australians

    • Nah haven’t been but have always wanted to go.

      Have you seen this twitter? He takes pictures of ships through the Bosphorus. I love looking at the city behind.

      https://twitter.com/yorukisik?lang=en

      Ever since I read of the events on June 11 1312 BC I have wanted to visit Hisarlik too.

      Link busted

      Title:
      The Trojan war dated by two solar eclipses.
      Authors:
      Henriksson, Goran
      Affiliation:
      AA(Department of Physics and Astronomy, Uppsala University S-751 20 Uppsala, Sweden)
      Publication:
      Mediterranean Archaeology and Archaeometry, Vol. 12, Iss. 1, pp. 63-76
      Publication Date:
      00/2012
      Origin:
      AUTHOR
      Keywords:
      Iliad, Homer, Trojan War, Total Solar Eclipse, Achilles, Patroclus, Troy VI, Wilusa, Muwatalli II and Mursili II.
      Bibliographic Code:
      2012MAA….12…63H
      Abstract
      The Trojan War was very significant for the ancient Greeks and they dated historical events according to the number of years after the fall of Troy. However, there was already in antiquity no consensus as to the exact date of the war when compared with different epochs. Even after the modern discovery of the ancient city, there has been disagreement among different excavators as to which layer corresponds to the city mentioned in the Iliad attributed to Homer. In this paper an attempt is made to identify the strange obscuration of the sun that occurred during the final battle of the Iliad as a total solar eclipse close to the southern border of the zone of totality. There exists only one solar eclipse that corresponds to the description in the text and this is the total solar eclipse of June 11, in 1312 BC. When I first presented this date in 1986, there was a difference of about 60 years compared with the most common archaeological dating at that time. My date is now fully supported by the latest results from the German-American excavation that identifies the fall of Homer’s Troy with the destruction of the archaeological layer Troy VIh, dated to about 1300 BC. Further independent support is provided by another solar eclipse that dates the reign of the Hittite king Muwatalli II. This king wrote a letter to king Alaksandu in Wilusa, identified as the Hittite name for Ilios, the most frequently used name for Troy in the Iliad. Alexander was another name for Paris who abducted Helen, the crime that resulted in the war. Muwatalli II was king 1315-1297 BC, according to the chronology for the Hittite Kingdom based on a solar eclipse in 1335 BC, during the tenth year of King Mursili II (1345- 1315 BC), the father of Muwatalli II.

      • When you go to Istanbul, you can take an overnight bus tour to Gallipoli and Troy.

        I had not realised there were ten Troys, each built on the ruins of the previous one. From memory, the horse one was Troy IV or V. (Edit: ah completely wrong! It was Troy VII). You can tour the excavated ruins. There is a wooden horse there too, complete with Americans asking the tour guide if it is really the real one.

        Troy was strategically located because the prevailing winds forced ships close to the coast there on their way to the Bosphorus. Eventually, improvements in sailing technology and shifts in the wind due to changes in the climate over the centuries meant ships no longer passed close that way, and the city dwindled away.

      • Turkey was fantastic when I spent a long time there 30 years ago. Heinrich Schliemann found Troy by matching the topography with the descriptions in the Iliad!

      • Troy is certainly a place to see.
        late April (spring) is best time.
        There is a lot to see & do in & around Istanbul.
        It’s a huge city but the good stuff is very concentrated & easy to get to / and cheap.
        Walking / Sultanahmet all of it, Hagia Sophia, palace & grounds, Topaki including the Mohammed relics, Ataturk etc, the grand bazaar, hippodrome, golden horn, the new bridge.
        Then the public ferry way up the Bosphorus to the Black Sea & last fort & back, dinner Testi Kebap meat & vegetables slow cooked in sealed clay pots, later Lalile / Russian nightclubs the woman, gunshots at 4am..

        Short Trips ; Gallipoli – do the full trip both to Anzac cove but also to the top lone pine & trenches that’s where maybe a mistimed naval shell & Attaturk turned it.
        Then other side : Troy day trip, was the original ancient strategic coast fort (now well up on the hill), very small but dense in many layers of settlement & history, eerie & full of ghosts & battles past.
        Longer trips
        Pamukkale volcanic old Roman baths medicinal healing hot springs.(Note all the tomb stones on entry)
        Bodrum, buy a rug, ferry over to Rhodes and some haram bacon & eggs & cheap booze, see the old town, where Colossus was, Greek oregano lamb chops & lemon, lote of good beaches, crusader castles & forts
        Private Car or even bus to get around or hire one of you enjoy fast combat driving v the Turks.
        The buses are like little old fashioned planes inside with big comfy seats & a tea boy serving drinks & snacks.
        It’s all very cheap & safe place to visit.

    • I think the tard comment suits you like a glove, Remote. You’ve been here 5 min, so I guess you can be forgiven for not knowing that your comment about annualising is the standard here.

    • Tards?

      You seem like a very unpleasant person. I wonder what happened to make you that way.

      I hope you soon get sick of wanking here and go annoy other people somewhere else.

      Please don’t buy a membership.

      • Mate you should be thanking me for prompting you to think about the likely severity of the ‘crash’. But unfortunately tards such as yourself are so caught up with the whole crash fantasy you refuse to look at the situation objectively.

        I notice you are responsible for many of the stupid posts annualising short term movements….is that why you are so offended? I think I shall refer to you as King Tard henceforth

    • Corelogics daily indices have always been a total joke. The fact they came up with it at all demonstrates the nature of the credit bubble.

    • Heh. So you’ll be referring to me in future? King Tard? Go for broke…I can’t wait.

      I’m gonna annualise every daily data point I see from now on, just so I can have the pleasure of causing you to refer to me.

    • imisslancedriver

      Let’s make it slightly less short term, combine it with yesterday’s 0.19% drop and annualised that then, shall we? We’ll all be buying 200k quarter acre blocks in no time at that rate.

    • Except for you no one else annualised daily price movements. Few have commented on some specific large daily movements but no one seriously suggested that such data is good indicator where prices will be in 12 months time.
      Yes, few of us wishes RE crashes but for different reasons from what you may think. Hint.. I am not jealous on anyone that made millions from the Ponzi.

      • This tard puts its claw up and admits annualising house price drops.

        It all started when I calculated the yield on some bonds and they pay twice a year so I had to annualise it. Harmless enough.

        Then I started on some coke shares I found lying around. Twice a year but the yield changed, I was getting hooked.

        One day I found myself annualising my trading profits after a sweet 20% profit and thought I had hit rock bottom, until I discovered CoreLogic daily price movements. Now I can’t help myself. I can’t stop annualising things.

        My name is haroldus and I am a tard.

      • The Traveling Wilbur

        Dr. Zoidberg: A-ha! Once again the sandwich-heavy portfolio pays off for the hungry investor! [Eats his sandwich] Oh no! I’m ruined!

        Futurama, “Futurestock”

      • Except for you no one else annualised daily price movements.

        See? This is the problem with tards such as yourself, you never pay attention or read carefully. I suggest you go back through past articles and verify if your statement is true.

        I shall refer to you henceforth as Prolapsed Anus (in reference to the repeated violent hammering the Oz housing market has doled out on your sphincter)

    • Nothing worthy in your post, just reincarnation of bile (yeah you). Yet you keep doing it, a succour to insecurity. Grow up.

      • wah, wah, wah….has housing dropped far enough that you can buy yet? Didnt think so

        Aaahahahahah

    • The butthurt emanating from the crashtards is amusing. I guess that is to be expected giving how much of a reaming the market has given you guys over the last decade (or even since 2015).

      And Lwschp King Tard…one thing I do agree with…..you should absolutely change your handle!

  9. To further a conversation from yesterdays macro afternoon posting with Brenton and wolf et al – a taste:

    “Can you describe the economy before the recession and how we got there?

    A lot of people tend to mischaracterize the crisis as a housing crisis. If it had merely been the inflated values of housing, we would not have had the whole panic we had in the fall of 2008. The financial system seizing up was the result of derivative debts that were piled on top of the housing debts and created synthetic exposures that were four to six times the amount of the real economy’s sub-prime debts. And a lot of those debts wound up being held by systemically important and fragile financial institutions like AIG, Citibank, UBS. Go down the list.

    The longer version of why this happened is that you had deregulation that started all the way back in 1970, when the New York Stock Exchange ended its requirement that exchange members be partnerships. That was a very significant shift that hasn’t been noticed. And as a result of the interest-rate volatility in the 1980s, you had lots of deregulation of banks then, and you had the Federal Reserve’s decision not to regulate derivatives in the ’90s.” – snip

    “It was very clear reading the Financial Times that with every type of credit instrument the risk was underpriced. The risk was grossly underpriced so that investors and lenders were throwing money in all kinds of different markets at borrowers and not being paid enough for the risk. And that means you’re going to have lots of losses down the road.” – snip

    http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2018/08/yves-smith-on-why-we-didnt-see-the-2008-crash-coming.html

    • I don’t really agree with that; if the biggest factor was the financial system the economy should have recovered pretty quickly because the banks and shadow banks repaired their balance sheets pretty quickly (over less than a 12 month period).

      • I thought the whole trickle down aspect was noted, not that the government offset with any fiscal for low to middle wage earners.

  10. https://www.domain.com.au/news/mirabella-family-in-stoush-with-residents-over-planned-lygon-street-brunswick-development-20180810-h13qpw-757570/

    Got to love the Mirabella cognitive dissonance…

    “My father has been contemplating this for a very long time,” said company manager George Mirabella, Paul and Silvana’s son. “The residents think my father is doing this for money — that’s not right.”

    Then it gets better..

    He told Domain the apartment block would beautify and revitalise a neighbourhood he claimed was regularly trashed with used syringes and graffiti. “I’ve got a Maserati and I’ve changed six or seven tyres because of needles,” he said, adding that the proposed building would have a 24-hour security presence.

    “I want to do something beautiful, not to make money, but to enjoy the environment I live in.”

    Do these people believe their own BS?

    And the best bit is the double standards 😁

    Her neighbour, Rachel, said the street was protected by a strict heritage overlay. “I can’t even alter my fence, but they can build this?” she asked.

    I hope this gets approved… For every pro mass immigration fanatical idiot living in Brunswick.

    • Those opposed to the development sound like racialists. Don’t they know the Mirabella family is a migrant success story? :p

    • St JacquesMEMBER

      Standards? What’s that? lol
      Great comic find Gav. Get a load of the zeitgeist. When a proposed development of flats designed on Vauban’s principles of fort construction is publicly defended as a selfless contribution to public aesthetics, you know we have reached peak dumb as a society. And just listen to that screeching self-serving entitlement, we have money, we can do what we want, get out of the way pleb! – that’s Straya today.

      • That’s exactly what I was thinking also. I think some of these older generation immigrants are the worst actually when it comes to sheer greed and money. They forget where and what they came from and have a very much take it all mentality. My landlord is an older Italian bloke. Absolute pig of a man.

        As a side note I’ve always wondered how Italian’s could produce some of the most beautiful automotive shapes, but some of the most hideous housing in this country.

    • That part of Brunswick has been gentrified for over ten years. I’m sure drugs existed in the area but it was never an Abbotsford or Footscray. Reservoir and Nth Coburg is now where a lot of the kids live because they’ve been priced out of Brunswick. They rehabilitated the suburb and others clean up on the rents.

  11. I have been following the for sale advertisements for apartments in the area where I live (heavily apartmented suburb within 10 km of Sydney CBD). Over the past few months prices had definitely been falling – so places had sold for a loss compared to their off the plan price, others were down 10%, others roughly flat compared to 12 months before.

    A lot of stock has started to build on the market of late, and I had been expecting further price falls, although the for sale prices for a bunch of new listings over the past fortnight have been slightly higher – back around the prices of 12 months ago. I suspect it is just owners with unrealistic expectations, but I would have thought the agents would be telling them that their were too high right off the bat. I will definitely be keeping an eye on it.

  12. Wino ShinyfaceMEMBER

    Channel 9’s Newspaper has gone full retard this weekend with dah immigrants will save us from getting old thing, cos they’re a magical people who don’t age at all. Australia: dumbest western country on the 🌍

    • Australians are fine… our elites on the other hand. These people are definitely stupid.

      Its becoming more and more obvious that the elite have no idea how to solve any of our problems. They are however, willing to try any strategy which might line their pockets. As this becomes the defacto view of the populace, its going to become more interesting.

      As always, to our traitorous elite/elite aspirational’s, ‘Its a sectoral shift, new tech will create new jobs, have you considered re-training? There is a $500 voucher you can get for online programming courses!’ – seriously. Did you not see how well this advice worked when the manufacturing jobs were busy being outsourced by your mates in high society? It’ll work for you too.

    • Don’t even need for them to age, get the parents over on a family reunion visa and the demographics are already going in the wrong direction.

    • So does anyone know exactly what he did to bring that Chimney down? It looks like he gutted 1 side, then put a bunch of firewood in there to do what exactly? Was it supposed to burn the foundation? I was trying to work out exactly how that was supposed to work, but it was impressive seeing it fall. Pretty dangerous line of work compared to what most people do these days in an office.

      • Wino ShinyfaceMEMBER

        like what you have said, must be the failing studs he was hammering into place, pretty liberal use of tyres, were they needed to get it so hot the bricks gave up as well

    • To somewhat answer my own question, watching it again. I can see wooden pillars are put in place and burning them causes them to fail and the whole thing to come down.

      I’ve actually been watching the series. Makes you think about marriage in another way. Poor guy. Busted his balls grafting.

    • Very interesting. Imagine how solid that guy was. Climbing up chimneys like that and swing a hammer all day. If he punched you in the face I think you’d need reconstructive surgery afterwards!

  13. Recent Glass Pyramids posts “MyRBA: Banking without the banks” and “Fixing Oz Banks: The critical Bank Royal Commission reform” have discussed some major reforms to Australian banking including the introduction of MyRBA deposit accounts for any Australian who wants one at the Reserve Bank of Australia.

    However, a number of eager readers of the Glass Pyramid have requested a simple explanation of what banks currently do and why that is a problem anyway.

    This is important because there are many myths and misconceptions about what it is that banks actually do.

    The following is as an outline of the beating heart of what banks do.

    Getting this clear is important for understanding the posts above and future posts on why it is problem and why we need to be talking about reforms that will address those problems.

    https://theglass-pyramid.com/2018/08/11/fixing-oz-banks-why-is-taking-deposits-so-important-to-bank-lending/

    Have a good weekend.

    • So, banking is unstable unless it is constantly expanding? Debt can never be paid down in aggregate without breaking the system? Have I got that right?Would explain everyone’s unquestioning fetishisation of “growth”.

      • Yes,

        I think it does explain the drive for growth. The need to chase the interest means work must be done so payment can be received and generating and finding work then becomes a critical policy objective.

    • I’m not sure about the ‘you need new ever expanding deposits/loans to pay the previous loans plus interest’ theory. Because money circulates with a velocity of greater than 1, I think that it is possible for interest to be repaid without an expansion of the money supply through even more lending.

    • Alfonso,

      I don’t think the velocity ultimately solves the problem. I think it is fair to say that if someone obtains a transfer from someone who received a freshly created deposit and transfers it to the bank as the interest payment, that interest payment might transferred to a shareholder who could transfer it (again for work or some other consideration) to the person who transfered it to the first borrower but that person will only be where they started. Namely with a deposit equal to the loan.

      And this assumes that the interest payment is moving and does not just pile up in someone’s account.

      The pressure or chase for the ‘interest’ remains.

      • I have never found a satisfactory answer to this question

        Your scenario presupposes there is no government taxation and no government deficit/surplus.

        What would happen if all private debt were repaid and all government debt repaid?
        How much AUD would be left in deposits?
        I presume that there would have been some gold-backed AUD at some stage?

      • Coming,

        I dont think there is a satisfactory answer. I dont see how any realistic velocity could completely remove the pressure created by interest.

        It is the unsatiable thirst.

        I left out the government and the ability of the RBA to create deposits so as to focus on on the nature of bank deposits and how lending creates them and being able to take deposits is critical to how a bank operates.

        Needless to say non banks cannot take deposits which means they cannot classify an account payable arising from a loan as a deposit.

        Insofar as the insatiable thirst (interest on loans) is concerned I think the key attraction of publicly created deposits is to create them interest free.

        While people may still seek interest on loans of those publicly created deposits at least they are created free of interest.

      • Stock and flow confusion. Deposits are a stock, interest a flow. The same deposit could settle all interest payments. How does $100b in base money pay for Australia’s GDP?

      • o07…
        And you get cranky when called a monetarist moeny crank… sigh…

        Not that Hudons latest offering does not put to bed the vast majority of navel gazing some call mainstream economics or Bill Blacks unpacking of MBA fraud doing a round about through the shadow sector, but yeah, the ev’bal demon pigs of interest made them do it.

      • Alfonso,

        Thanks for the link.

        I dont have a problem with Steve’s comment.

        His point is a fair point, the created deposits, may flow around around many times before repayment of the principal or the interest, so it is not as straightforward as simply saying the loan does not create the interest.

        But by the same token he is not saying that interest is completely irrelevant either, nor is he saying that a model where most deposits if not all are created with an interest charge attached does not have significance.

        It is a matter of degree and not overstating the case.

        I will update the post to include reference to this issue.

      • Good to see single issue Sweeper working on his single issue. Private Bank apologia.

        Keep up the focus Sweeps!. Never a word to say about the Royal Commission though?. Wonder why?

        Skippy, did you even bother to watch Hudson?. You are very good at ignoring the bits by Hudson that are aimed right at you. He was slamming your private bank buddies right back to Babylon. He has no time for your financial sector rent seeking mates.

      • Funny how I saw it as him slamming the corporatists rigging the game for personal reasons, albeit banks do play their part. Did you see where he’s going? Still that has nothing to do with your opinion on interest forces these events. I also see you failed to reconcile Blacks evidence.

        Btw something for you at the bottom of the comments list.

        PS you never seem to understand when I say I have bigger fish to fry, but banks are just a plank in your eye due to the antiquarian beliefs you hold. If all I thought was we have a banking problem I would agree with you, but there is a whole other level to this thing. Something you steer completely away from.

      • The chart that keeps on giving:
        https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/?g=faBx

        So at the peak of the GFC in the US there was about $25T in debt owed by the non-financial private sector and only $330B in demand deposits (less than a qtr of amt in money market funds at the time btw).

        Have you yet cottoned on to what this means for your whole theory of commercial banking 007?

      • I think that article is the first time I have ever agreed with Keen.

        Someone else once described the 99.9% group as “the most disinterest body of persons in the world, the Army of Heretics and Cranks whose numbers and enthusiasm are extraordinary”

        So it wasn’t me or Skippy who invented the money crank label for your team 007.

        Full passage in context from Vol 2 Bk 7 of the Treatise on Money:

        “In so far as they are cash-deposits, he is acting both as a provider of money for his depositors, and also as a provider of resources for his borrowing customers. Thus the modern banker performs two distinct sets of services”

        “The dilemma of modern banking is satisfactorily to combine these two functions. As a purveyor of Representative Money, it is the duty of the banking system to preserve the prescribed objective standard of such money. As a purveyor of loans on terms and conditions of a particular type, it is the duty of the system to adjust, to the best of its ability, its supply of this type of lending to the demand for it at the equilibrium rate of interest, ie. at the natural rate…
        the complete attainment of one of its duties is sometimes incompatible with the complete attainment of the other, those in control of the banking system have to make up their minds which object is to prevail, or, if neither is to prevail, to achieve a just compromise between the two”.

        Keynes was trying to get the point across to the 99.9% (which in my experience is almost impossible) that the two activities of 1) provider of resources on asset side and 2) provider of money on liability side are completely unrelated and contradictory, serving two unrelated demands and meeting one demand does nothing for the other. And that the two activities only started being carried out by the same entity due to the historical accident of representative money.

        which is probably why qty (and direction) of one doesn’t determine qty of the other as per the chart .

        “A partial selection of some amongst these truths and a blind eye to others of them have led to the opposed points of view which are characteristic between them of the vast bulk of non-academic monetary literature. On the one hand, there are the bankers, who at least maintain a certain sanity of demeanour by holding tight to rough rules-of-thumb which they have learn’t from experience. On the other hand, there is the most disinterest body of persons in the world, the Army of Heretics and Cranks whose numbers and enthusiasm are extraordinary”

        I feel his frustration.

      • Sweeper,

        You keeping dragging out that graph yet you still don’t understand what it means do you?

        Non bank debt has nothing to do with bank balance sheets.

        Demand deposits are deposits available on demand. The word demand is a bit of a hint.

        Use them to buy some other banking system liability (say a bond) and they are no longer demand deposits.

        Funny thing though some folks reckon everything on the liability side of a bank balance sheet is considered a ‘deposit’ in the loose sense.

        But guess what!

        Both sides of a bank balance sheet still balance.

        Are you trying to invent a new form of Sweeper double entry accounting which does not balance?

      • oh dear. 007 if a banks liabilities cannot also be used as means of exchange, then it follows they cannot have been created in the act of lending or act of buying securities for that matter… so your whole theory crumbles. do you disagree with that? or are you now claiming it’s possible to buy a house with a bank bond? If you agree with that do you acknowledge what it means for your theory?
        The fact they issue bonds and other non-money debt should tell you they have to fund themselves just like any other business

      • Sweeper,

        Whatever gloss Keynes added the fact remains that a bank has a single balance sheet that must balance.

        The contract of loan gives rise to a loan asset and a matching ‘deposit’ created out of thin air.

        The acceptance or ‘taking’ of a deposit may debit an asset but often it simply involves a debit against another deposit – often a deposit that was created out of thin air.

        Managing the deposits that are backed by thin air is what bankers do but it is a self inflicted state of affairs.

        No tears here for you, you poor frustrated thing.

      • Sweeper,

        “..The fact they issue bonds and other non-money debt should tell you they have to fund themselves just like any other business..”

        Of course they have to honour those deposits created out of thin air. But as I point out in my post the key to doing that lies in their ability to take deposits.

        I appreciate that your job is to simply run interference and deny that banks are different to other financial firms but you simply cannot get around the problem that only banks by law can take deposits and they also label their obligations arising from making a loan a deposit.

        If you insist, as you tediously do, that deposits are nothing special then banks should surrender the authorisation to take them AND make them.

        But nope it never happens.

        Funny about that it.

      • the bit about accounting just makes no difference.
        You are not talking about accounting you are talking about the link between deposit creation and lending for commercial banks. Stop moving the goal posts just because its clear there is no link therefore no privilege.
        Yes their balance sheets balance. But the key point is the two activities are self supporting independent activities which just happen to be carried out by the same entity (although by different people who wouldn’t have a clue what the other is doing/planning).
        A similar example in terms of the balance sheet would be an insurance company.
        The breakup of their assets in terms of return and liquidity is completely unrelated to qty of policies. Both are driven by other factors eg. capital, profitability, probability of payouts etc.

      • “Of course they have to honour those deposits created out of thin air. But as I point out in my post the key to doing that lies in their ability to take deposits”.

        no it doesn’t. the deposits are not their money they are their lenders money (or lenders claims on money). They can only honour their deposits with their own money.

        the key to honouring their deposits lies in staying solvent so they’ve got assets which can be pledged for money on the asset side and lenders willing to lend them money. and btw they can’t take new deposits if they are insolvent.

      • Sweeper,

        “…The contract of loan gives rise to a loan asset and a matching ‘deposit’ created out of thin air….”

        Ducking and weaving will not help you evade the important point.

        When the loan entries are created a bank creates an credit entry called a deposit and NOTHING has been deposited.

        Not a single dry cracker. The cupboard is completely bare.

        It is nothing more than an accounts payable and the ‘asset’ is nothing more than a promise by the borrower to repay something a ‘deposit’ that at that instant is simply nothing more than an accounting record. An accounts payable entry that has been simply called a deposit.

        The rest is an interest accruing shell game.

        All given substance by a stream of publicly created deposits that keep the game alive.

      • Clearly you are just engaging in journalism and have no interest in getting to the bottom of it.
        No one is arguing that, the question is can banks finance their assets through deposit creation? No they can’t and don’t per chart. The fact the deposit is created to buy something rather than to be held as an asset should tell you that straight away.

      • o07…

        Sad case of the child crying orphan after killing their parents.

        Decades of economic libertarians and neoliberals established a criminogenic enviroment along with weaponizing USD for corporatist machinations, this combined with the attack on wages, because of ideological reasons masked in inflation scare mongering has created this mess. – not the concept of banking in and of itself.

        Again I refer to Blacks unpacking of the MBA case due to lack of regulation and resultant effects in broad daylight – with the help of the shadow sector / tax havens.

        In case you forget the deposits are an asset wrt future income in the form of a contract e.g. all money is a contract, contracts proceed tokens in physical form. Now if you had not filled your head with all that Rothbardin rubbish before getting religion about it, you might have taken the time to do a more expansive historical reading, but naw, some lead with ignorance and bias confirmation. Then spend their entire lives grousing on about how ev’bal fiat money keeps the light from washing over everyone.

      • Yes exactly; 007 can’t or probably doesn’t want to at this point acknowledge that deposits are an asset and what that means – ie someone has to choose to hold them over other assets when return is available. because he is fixated by the Rothbardian idea that they are just fake warehouse receipts.
        He also doesn’t want to acknowledge that chart which says deposits don’t finance credit. Actually the more money like the liability the less likely it is financing credit and the more likely it is financing securities and other liquid assets.
        eg. pre deregulation when commercial banks had caps on credit and quotas on government securities they actually issued more deposits as a proportion of liabilities. Or money market funds – usually they don’t finance any new credit. All their assets are usually securities bought in the secondary market.
        Which again says money like liabilities generally finance liquid assets which doesn’t include new credit. And credit finances credit. Exactly as per the chart.

      • The most bizarre thing is that post deregulation in the neoliberal era commercial banking has seen deposits dramatically fall as a share of commercial bank liabilities.
        Yet 007 is trying to make the argument that deposit creation is the fundamental enabler behind neoliberalism…

      • Sweeper I don’t think o07 grasps what Hudons said and – or per SOP inserts banks into it and starts speaking in tongues [rothbard].

        Probably does not even understand the relationship with strong dollar policy wrt offshoring and outsourcing e.g. they are a transfer from lower level workers to senior execs. This has nada to do with shareholder values, except that analysts are enamored enough with the concept that they’ll approve of these plans, typically giving the stock a pop, but yeah ev’bal faceless fake warehouse receipts….

      • Good to see the private bank apologist dynamic duo working hard on a Sunday!

        “No one is arguing that, the question is can banks finance their assets through deposit creation? ”

        Sorry Sweeps arguing that banks don’t create deposits out of thin air is EXACTLY what you and the big Potaroo argue.

        Finance their assets through deposit creation?

        What a load of baloney. The asset is a loan contract and requires no financing.

        What requires financing is the honoring of the deposit (really just an accounts payable) created out of thin air.

        And that is not hard to do because as long as no one tries to withdraw it from the banking system as cash there is nothing to honor.

        Shifting ‘deposits’ within a bank or between banks is just a matter of accounting entries.

        It is the shell game.

      • o07…

        What part about credit from an historical point don’t you grasp, even before banks were around e.g. it matters not your opinion on the matter as its part of our history and one could say DNA. Yet this still does not square the operating enviroment that enables anti social behavior which precludes hard asset or pure fiat use. Not that hard asset use is dictated by law and gov still sets the price or conversely having the market do it and were right back to free floating – see history on that regard.

        Wellie I’d rather argue with facts and not ideology oo07, but then what can one expect from a corporatist apologist’.

      • Can I ask again :
        If all private and public debt were repaid would there be zero AUD left in deposits (demand and nondemand)?

        Or would there be less than or more than zero?

        Can someone explain one way or the other

      • I can see scenarios where all private and public debt is repaid yet base money and deposits grow.
        Eg banks buy real assets, non debt financial assets & increase bank reserves and issue a heap of deposits and the CB accommodates increase in desired reserves and base money by creating a heap of base money and buying gold foreign currency etc.
        the only way it could happen is if interest rates were zero otherwise the public wouldn’t want the deposits and currency and banks wouldn’t want all the reserves.
        Likewise there are many scenarios where credit could grow rapidly and deposits and base money fall in absolute terms especially in a strong economy with increasing interest rates. eg. New credit moves to non banks and commercial banks sell safe assets to public / redeeming deposits sell reserves back to CB in exchange for bonds to maintain desired ratios and reconfigure their balance sheet to more new credit as a share of assets funded by wholesale funding.
        This is actually the general pattern of banking in a growing economy – eg. securitisation pre GFC.

      • Sweeper I’m not clever enough to understand your reply

        If there was no outstanding government debt there would be no bonds to buy
        The bonds would be matured and repaid

        Or have I misunderstood (again)

      • Sweeper,

        “..You just have no interest in reality do you 007?..”

        No problem with reality but it is true I don’t have much time for private bank apologists who dodge the issue

        Do you deny that when a bank creates a loan it creates a “deposit” out of thin air?

        Do you deny that NOTHING has been deposited with the bank when that entry is created?

        Do you agree the created deposit is nothing more than an accounts payable.

        Do you deny that ONLY a bank can take a deposit.

        The rest is just a lot of banker hand waving and accounting entries.

      • The bonds were in the second scenario Coming. Where credit growth accompanies an absolute fall in base and broad money.

        The first scenario was the one you were talking about.

      • That’s just a pathetic response 007.
        Every time you run out of argument you resort to calling me and Skippy bank apologists.

      • Sweeper: the scenario is that there is no government debt – so no one can exchange deposits for bonds

        “I can see scenarios where all private and public debt is repaid yet base money and deposits grow.
        Eg banks buy real assets, non debt financial assets & increase bank reserves and issue a heap of deposits and the CB accommodates increase in desired reserves and base money by creating a heap of base money and buying gold foreign currency etc.
        the only way it could happen is if interest rates were zero otherwise the public wouldn’t want the deposits and currency and banks wouldn’t want all the reserves.”

        Banks buy “real assets” from whom? and with what money?

        I’m afraid I don’t follow

        In the article Skippy linked it says “The monetary system is nothing but a system of credits cancelling debts…”

        If this is true then it should sum to 0 – is this correct?

        The government bonds have all matured, private debts have all been repaid – we are now in a world with 0 deposits and 0 loans?
        And reserves would also be 0?

      • Thanks for your response coming…

        Per Hudson and other MMT camp views gov bonds are a hang over from the gold standard in an ad hoc political response to capitals claims to have rights on funding society.

      • There’s no bonds in the first scenario Coming.
        Banks buy real assets from the public crediting them with deposits. Banks sell some assets eg gold and fx to CB in exchange for reserves and currency.
        Completely operationally possible.

      • You haven’t answered my question

        Where is the bank getting the deposits to buy the assets?

        In order to pay down all the private debt ever created and to extinguish government debt , deposits will be destroyed

        My question is : is there enough to do so?
        If not why not

      • “Do you deny that when a bank creates a loan it creates a “deposit” out of thin air?”

        WTF I just referenced well worn history oo07…. all credit from time immoral is based on expectation’ or thin air, yes this is complicated by environmental factors [force majeure] or plan old reneging [abysmal ethical standards].

        It might behoove you to consider the ethical standards of society say per Veblen and the responsibility incumbent on all parties concerned in facilitating social uplift through capitalism vs the rentier.

      • Coming where do C-corps get the funding to do stock by backs for a short term increase in equity price, regardless a nation is not a corporation if it issues and forces everyone to use its mode of exchange. Something a corporation can not do.

      • Again stock flow confusion.
        btw explain to me how deposits would be “destroyed” if the government bought back it’s bonds by giving the bond holders the national parks for example.

      • re the deposits to buy the assets. I’ve already said banks create deposits when they buy stuff. But this is 1/10 of the story. They have also have find someone to hold the deposit as an asset.

      • Sweeper,

        “..Every time you run out of argument you resort to calling me and Skippy bank apologists…”

        Nope.

        I call you and pouchy “Private Bank Apologists” when you duck and weave and refuse to answer simple questions.

        Which is exactly what you just did.

        Looks like Coming is working out your routine as well.

        Just to make it easy for you here they are again

        Do you deny that when a bank creates a loan it creates a “deposit” out of thin air?

        Do you deny that NOTHING has been deposited with the bank when that entry is created?

        Do you agree the created deposit is nothing more than an accounts payable.

        Do you deny that ONLY a bank can take a deposit.

      • Your question about credits cancelling debts is finally an interesting one. And it depends on whether base money is really a debt of the government.
        Current accounting convention is to recognise base money as debt on the consolidated CB/Treasury balance sheet.
        But there is debate about it. Is an instant maturity non interest bearing “debt” really a debt? Not in PV terms as the intrinsic value is zero and there is no claim on it in bankruptcy. The government cannot default on its cash.
        Recognising it as a debt actually makes no sense. Some economists (eg Buiter) have claimed the face value of base money should also be taken to equity which is probably right.

      • Good dawg Sweeper are you the only one that feels like were talking about why some dude got nailed to some wood to forgive everyone else sins after some antiquarian stuff about drunks musing about sons authority over others. Considering said persons main grievance was the biopolitical nature of his ethnic grouping with regard to wealth, social authority and extractive tendencies…. crap whom knew he was a social democrat… lmmao

      • I don’t deny it is created out of thin air. What matters is whether anyone wants to hold the “thin air” deposit as an asset. If not it won’t be created in the first place.

      • I don’t have a dog in this fight , but to be honest it does indeed seem like a shell game

        The “value” of the AUD is determined by how many exist
        How much would the national parks be worth ?
        If there was only 1AUD left in deposits they would be worth 50cents and so forth

        How much would the central banks gold be worth ?
        Similar

        If we had a scenario where the government legislated that it must be in neither deficit nor surplus, and banks could not create deposits, how much would one AUD be worth ?

        How did we end up in a scenario where somehow private individuals end up owning public assets ?
        This was their accrued labour costs once everything was summed ?

        So the AUD in circulation are the governments liability and claims to that are fulfilled by for instance the land of Australia

        10 years later and I still find the whole thing quite mystifying

      • Having a unit of account doesn’t depend on their being means of exchange denominated in the unit of account.
        eg. The national parks could be priced in AUD but traded for gold or for bonds (priced in AUD)

      • ROTFLOL…., priced in AUD….ahahahahah~~~~~ muhahahha….

        Ohhh Sweeper best belly laugh I’ve had in a long time, thank you sir.

      • I’m utterly lost now

        But I would suggest that the thought exercise demonstrates that as credit contracts, deposits become more valuable relatively (relative to the national parks for instance)

        And therefore the inverse is true : as credit expands deposits become less valuable relative to real assets

        Therefore the banks are incentivised to expand debt to make their liabilities worth less relative to their assets

        And pfh’s original sentiment is validated

      • huh… coming…

        Does your camp ever tire of monoliths as deductively deduced regardless of environmental aspects. Some can’t seem to distinguish anything out side so called rational agent models.

        What a small world.

      • This is what I don’t get; if you are really lost then just look at the chart I posted. You guys are choosing to be lost.. in 007’s case because it makes for good journalism.

        And the point was that the unit of account and means of exchange can be different (and have been throughout history). So qty of means of exchange doesn’t determine the national parks value.

      • “Everything is for sale under neoliberalism Skippy”

        Oh…. not to mention intellectual ethics good sir – !!!!!

      • Sweeper: what is the chart supposed to illustrate?

        There is no relationship between credit and demand deposits

        “The demand deposits component of M1 is defined as total demand deposits at commercial banks and foreign related institutions other than those due to the U.S. government, U.S. and foreign depository institutions, and foreign official institutions.”

        so it says nothing about the relationship between credit, and other bank liabilities

        I’m not sure what I am supposed to get from this

      • Coming what does it matter considering ideological driven socio political machinations wrt to a price of a thing or you suggesting one can price the water cycle.

      • It says that banks can’t and don’t create “thin air” deposits to finance 99% of their lending so thin air abilities are a non event

      • Coming I guess then we could argue the entire private sector is valued on thin air without Gov support.

      • If you think that chart ties back to yours and 007’s theory of commercial banking can you please tell me how?

      • I don’t believe the chart proves anything at all, but you do – I was hoping you could explain how

      • That there is no relationship between growth in new credit and ability to create “thin air” deposits which also serve as money.
        The thin air thing is a non event

      • how does this graph show that?

        It demonstrates an increase in demand deposits – which may imply nothing more than a concomitant reduction in non-demand deposits (probably from QE and the fed buying bonds)

      • oo07…

        Look I’m not the one attempting to reduce a multivariate problem down to interest, deposits, or chartered banks. Again I ref Hudson on BSDs in setting the stage, followed by Blacks treatment wrt reg arb and flows through opaque channels et al – e.g. none of this has anything to do with deposits etc. I would also note Hudson’s treatment of Austrians and mainstream econ ex ante habits in making them truth.

        I think my public record on banks over some years makes a mockery of your crude bank apologist meme. At the end of the day its just a sophist quip to divert attention from the failure of your core philosophical musings and how those were used to enable it all. So all you have left now is pining the blame on banks, even tho the shadow sector is manifold and a conduit for all kinds of criminal anti social activity, but yeah the whole thing is about fake warehouse receipts…. sigh….

      • Absolutely – California – 3rd wealthiest country on earth where living standards are so high, that the impoverished working poor are having to move to failed states with less than third world conditions – because its cheaper.

        What a FAILURE California is – Silicon Valley – what a joke ! Georgia and Arizona are where its at – suburb after suburb, county after county, city after city of meth crazed lunatics living in regions where the municipality has abandoned basic utilities. Sheriff Apirio – the most infamous racist corrupt person outside Duerte eagerly awaits your ass.

        And how can Californians “put up” with zombie scum on their streets ?! (Literally what was said). I mean – why not do what red states do and forcibly put them on buses, truck them out into the desert and leave them there.

        Literally a bunch of ultra conservatives sitting around BITCHING because California is so successful and the poor people are leaving – what ….the…..actual….fire…..truck.

  14. Today I was walking with the wife and son in the city of Canberra and I saw a small protest about “animal cruelty in Australia”.
    All of that is OK to me, what was shocking is that as I was walking we saw dozens of homeless blokes and middle aged ladies sitting and sleeping rough on the street. No one seems to care or protest for these guys.

    I stopped with one of the university students protesting and told him…so you know that we have the most corrupt government in Australia’s history, you have the largest dept, you have crisis in infrastructure, homelessness, poverty levels that never seen in Australia, power and energy bills that is busting business and bankrupting individuals, corrupt corporations that causes harm to the level of suicide, economy that is on the brink of a disaster and you chosen to protest about animal cruelty ?

    The guy stared at my face as if I am stripping in the middle of the street and nodded and smiled.

    We walked away, and I actually leaned on my wife and said “this scene much summarize Australia these days” darling.
    We smiled and continued our shopping.

    • No one seems to care or protest for these guys.

      […]

      We walked away, and I actually leaned on my wife and said “this scene much summarize Australia these days” darling.
      We smiled and continued our shopping.

      Indeed.

      • Oh tell me, great virtue signalling one, what would you have done in the same situation?

        Or did I mis-read the smugness and condescension coming from your little ‘indeed’, right at the end there?

    • Logic goes like this: A is worse than B, therefore trying to fix B is stupid. I’m not convinced.

      • A is eight times worse than B, you only have enough energy to protest against one of them, so…

        …so you pick B, because everyone agrees B is a nice cause, whereas A is hard, and will cause you to challenge most of your own fundamental beliefs and those of two thirds of society, so head goes firmly into sand.

        Makes sense to me.

      • Logic goes like this : A is 100 times worse than B, not protesting even once for A but protesting again and again for B is stupid…now I am the one whose not convinced

    • Good on those folk for protesting against animal cruelty. Perhaps they also do work on other issues, like homelessness.

      Maybe everyone who posted above me on this topic is also out there doing something about the homelessness issue, or something else they take to be important. If not, then show that it is as important as you proclaim it to be by going out and doing something about it.

      And, yes, I do volunteer my time on homelessness while also thinking that animal cruelty should be stopped. No, I am not a vegan/vegetarian but have the upmost respect for people who are.

      • Again as i said i had no problem with that. I am stating the irony and the amount of hypocrisy for protesting against the cruelty of the system towards sheep and other animals while a stroll away blokes and ladies just like you and me living in the streets in mass numbers not seen as a cruelty towards humans. It delusional to give the impression that these bunch of bourgeoisie rich parented existence really care about anything.
        I wished I had photoed them with the homeless in the background as it was very contrasting scene and you could see the students with their placards in the foreground with the homeless literally in the background.

      • How many of those homeless people did you give money, or food, or clothes, or anything, to ?

    • ASIC thinks that by not taking action they won’t scare investors, or is it they protect the criminal instead? The truth is there somewhere, but nor did the SEC/Obama do anything of substance after the GFC, and those crimes were greater and blew many good people away. It’s almost we need a regulator for the regulators as they are clearly not fit for purpose.

    • TailorTrashMEMBER

      “Cladding is the new asbestos. So assistance must come from government, just as it has for [houses with] Mr Fluffy.”
      …..so the taxpayers of Australia should chip in to pay for the recladding of these buildings ( many of which are owned by foreigners who bid out our own children )while the developers and builders
      ( some of which are foreigners ) slink way with their ill gotten gains …….and the sad thing is I can see Malcolm and Scomo supporting this ….
      ……..this is Straya mate in 2018 ……pathetic!
      Fcuk em I say ….you bought it …you own it…..enjoy your savy investment .

      • not sure on Monsanto but not impossible

        I saw pest control guy drink some of his magic potions to prove inertness to warm blooded humans (no joke here).
        God bless his soul, he died 10yrs ago, from Rock Hudson’s disease.

        Some folks smoke like Hazelwood plant and die old age, some light up a few and die of throat cancer. There are multiple avenues towards death some just pick the shortcut, by a chance or by taking a chance.

  15. i just made chili con carne out of diced lamb hearts

    is this a world first

    lamb hearts are like $5 a kilo so beat the hell out of rump or chuck steak for economy

    now im just a dude reading the mb comments enjoyin my meal, listening to some miles davis while drinking a can of canadian club whisky and cola i found unopened in a railway station trash can

    also my personal savings just hit 150k which is pretty good for an unemployed under 30

    still feels like nothin tho compared to the average aus property

      • Unfortunately, I’m unavailable for your next dinner party. And I’ve probably drunk the wine already.

      • Didn’t you get the invitation? Beans night tonight. A few stations over bulls stomping on nuts is a whole new blazing saddles experience. Was it you that said you’re after a gender realignment but its a bit expensive, well whoever it was, they can be set up on bucking ‘fluffy’, he’s lookin to return the favour; the ambos will dust em off.

        “I was really complementary with my post. I honestly thought that the poster I was replying to would be impressed by my compliment to him and respect me and become my friend.”

    • $150K?! That is truly awesome.

      Dare I ask (in a general investment non-intrusive sense) where you’ve put it? Ie Aus bank, USD, gold+ammo stash (LWSCHP style), MB fund, all in on Tesla shares, etc?

      PS nice work on the lamb hearts. Once I was massively hung over in Japan and bought a chicken skewer and then discovered it was chicken hearts. Uuuergh. Actually it was ok. But lamb hearts wins.

      • It was interesting to see what the recipe entrails. Luckily it wasn’t a load of tripe.

  16. Dude …you are the dude. A cook of note, and able to save while not working. Here’s my menu item for you… a cheap chicken breast, smash it flat, fill it with ; a half cup boiled rice soaked in garlic and mixed with ham/bacon. then roll the chicken around it …hold together with tooth picks …in the oven at 180c for 35mins. Serve a bed of steamed veggies.

    • Remember the initial RE ramp up was rich anglophones wanting a bug out in NZ during the first gulf war.

  17. Mining BoganMEMBER

    So no scheduled auctions in my suburb again. Three sold. Amazingly one sold last week as well in a week where there were no auctions. That’s a bloody miracle right there my friends.

    Another one that sold in July. Pretty sure there werè auctions in July but this one wasn’t one of them.

    Numberwang. Frankennumber. Bullsh!t. Pick your own description.

    • All they are doing is to try to engineer slow meltdown. Problem is this is not cooking so you can control the temperature at will. There will be a point where the sellers will rush for the gates all at once. My prediction is this will happen next year this time when we are in the middle of the IO to P&I reset. By next August prices (for both Syd and Mel) would be down another 6% or there about and most people will not have enough equity to refinance and be forced to sell.
      If something happens with China and their tourists and students disappear and China also slows importing coal and iron ore well we will be experiencing a depression.

      • the future is uncertain but as of today China is stimulating its arse off and new Chinese students are coming in for S2 as we speak.

      • True PSI. We won’t get those numbers until they settle (if they settle) in three months. In other words their effect on broad sale prices will be reported in the ABS figures for the Sep-Dec qtr which come out in April 2019!

        System working as intended.

        The only way to have any clue is to go to all the auctions in person. And even then you don’t know the truth / details of “sold prior” and “sold after”.

    • The real estate agent (Ray White Inner West) sends out a list of the inner west auction results and they look nothing like the Domain ones. You’d think that one of the official purveyors of results would provide more thorough and accurate results. I’d hate to sound like a conspiracy theorist, but could there possibly be an ulterior motive…
      (BTW I’m not MB’s Damien Klassen)

      ANNANDALE
      48 Pritchard Street. House. 2.1.1 Passed In
      133 View Street. House. 3.2.0 Passed In

      CAMPERDOWN
      107/5-11 Pyrmont Bridge Road. Apartment. 2.2.1 Sold Prior $1,025,000
      314/1 Layton Street. Apartment. 1.1.0 Passed In
      404/1 Missenden Road. Apartment. 1.1.1 Passed In

      CHIPPENDALE
      401/32 Regent Street. Apartment. 1.1.0 Passed In
      11 Little Queen Street. House. 3.1.0 Sold $1,025,000

      ERSKINEVILLE
      2/58 Park Street. Apartment. 1.1.1 Sold Prior $735,000
      B701/5 Hadfields Street. Apartment. 2.2.1 Passed In

      ENMORE
      24 Belmore Street. House. 3.1.1 Passed In

      LEICHHARDT
      37 Reuss Street. House. 3.2.1 Withdrawn
      133 Allen Street. House. 3.3.0 Withdrawn

      LILYFIELD
      27 Mary Street. House. 3.1.4 Sold Prior Undisclosed

      NEWTOWN
      7/83-91 Wilson Street. Apartment. 2.1.2 Passed In
      66/2-6 Brown Street. Apartment. 1.1.1 Sold $648,000
      4/2B Gladstone Street. House. 4.2.1 Withdrawn
      85 Watkin Street. House. 3.2.0 Sold $1,880,000
      30/104 Alice Street. Apartment. 1.1.1 Withdrawn
      48/3-13 Erskineville Road. Apartment. 1.1.0 Withdrawn
      101 Alice Street. House. 4.1.1 Sold $1,310,000
      7/489-491 King Street. Apartment. 1.1.0 Withdrawn

      STANMORE
      32 Northumberland Avenue. House. 3.1.0 Withdrawn
      4/2 Douglas Street. House. 3.3.1 Sold $1,470,000

    • Cooley Auctions clearance rate was 42% today selling 16 of 38.
      38 is 10% of total auctions. A significant sample indicating a wide divergence with Domain figures.

    • Mining Bogan,

      Are all these literally printed in Domain’s auction page with the address, advert and agent?

      Surely this is something that should be looked into? Has anyone contacted Domain or agents who would be able to explain themselves?

      • Mining BoganMEMBER

        The two really dodgy ones say sorry, no listing available. That happens a bit. The one in as sold two weeks in a row caught my interest because it was one we looked at to rent 18 months ago.

        It truly is amazing. No auctions here for two weeks yet six properties, one twice, have been listed as sold in auction results. Reckon the true clearance rate would be 30%.

        I casually mentioned it to the local RE guy down the shops. You don’t understand the system he says. What, corruption I say. I think he went inside to call the fixated persons hotline.

        We should be rioting like those nice Romanians.

    • Thing I don’t get is, why aren’t all the ROP enthusiasts on the next plane to China to help their brothers, protesting outside the embassy etc.

  18. The Bond Market Doesn’t Control Anything; the Currency-Issuing National Government Does
    Posted on July 26, 2018 by Ellis Winningham

    The mistakes made by the public with regard to public debt (national debts) are threefold. In the first instance, the public relies heavily on politicians and the media to tell them what to think. Secondly, the assumption is that the national government is no different than a household, and so, if the government goes into debt it must earn enough income to pay off that debt with interest, or it will become insolvent. This mistake is known as “the Fallacy of Composition” wherein the person is assuming that what is true for them in their individual case (the micro-level) must also be true for everyone including the national government (the macro-level). Thirdly, the assumption is that treasury bonds are issued to conduct fiscal policy; that is, to fund deficit spending.

    The truth of the matter is that, though they are not aware of it, much of the politics-following public is utterly unqualified to assess any information given to them by the media concerning treasury bonds and national debts. The media feeds them information based on false assumptions and the conclusion that the public reaches from these errant ideologically-driven foundations can be summarised by the following commentary:

    “We are 20 trillion in debt because both the Democrats and Republicans find it easier to spend in hopes of gaining votes then to show financial restraint. This is also a reflection of how many Americans handle their own finances. Future generations will pay for this dearly…”

    As we can easily see, all three assumptions are present in the above comment:

    1.) The person follows politics to some degree and has been “educated” on the subject of public debt by the media and politicians.

    2.) The person clearly assumes that the US government’s finances are just like a household’s (fallacy of composition).

    3.) The person assumes that treasury bonds allow the US government to spend more than it earns.

    If we follow this errant thinking to its totally absurd conclusion, we conclude that since most national governments have a national debt, and that since private debt levels are rising higher each year world-wide, then the whole world is in debt up to its eyeballs. We must then ask, “The whole world is in debt to whom?” and then the mass delusion reveals itself. Who can the entirety of the Earth’s human population, including corporations and governments, be in debt to? The Moon? The Oort Cloud? Perhaps, Pluto is lending Earth money and that’s why NASA was so adamant about a nine-year voyage to the planetoid – The world needed to drop off an interest payment before Pluto “called in the debt” and the world wanted to negotiate for more money. – snip

    http://elliswinningham.net/index.php/2018/07/26/bond-market-doesnt-control-anything-currency-issuing-national-government-2/

    • Ronin8317MEMBER

      The analysis misunderstand the true nature of debt. It’s an accounting illusion, and we are ‘borrowing’ from the future rather than each another. The danger of government debt is not the amount of deficit, but the total failure of government.

      • Sorry if I find the whole “true” *nature* of debt highly ideological and realistically unfounded. By your view we should have never left the hunter gather stage. Please show me the odds of a government aka a nation going poof in relationship to the post above. And lest we forget money is debt since its inception.

      • In addition this is kinda self fulfilling in my observations wrt those that are beholden to such views, but then premise their philosophy off a goal about the enviable collapse they dream of… work for…

  19. I just emailed my dentist suggesting it is time they took out my wisdom teeth,

    I hope they look at the time I sent it and ignore the email.

      • I’m pissed off cause now I have to go to the dentist, plus my missus and the daughter.

        Not only that but harry’s payin.

      • The Traveling Wilbur

        Okay, I’ll bite… so to speak…

        0237 hours and you’re still thinking about your roots? Must be the throbbing keeping you up.

        And if you sent that email just before you posted that comment, at around 2 30, how could she ignore it? It’s a dentist’s favourite time of day!

        : )

  20. Vibrancy update:

    https://www.smh.com.au/healthcare/the-missing-girls-never-born-in-australia-20180811-p4zwxr.html

    Melbourne GP and president of the Australia India Society of Victoria, Dr Gurdip Aurora, said he had recently encountered one likely case of gender selection involving a couple who had migrated from India.

    The pair already had three daughters, and the woman was pregnant again.

    “They wanted to have an ultrasound done and [then] decide whether they would have the child or not, if it happened to be a female,” Dr Aurora said.

    All courtesy of your Medicare dollars, BTW.

    • “your” or “those that pay taxes”?

      Should Medicare not be available for bogans/dole bludgers/lazy home brewed plebes with little or no tax paid?
      Should we have participation in medical bills proportional to the actual taxes paid?

      Perhaps if you understood that Medicare is not a function of entitlement or ancestry but rather correlated to taxes paid…

      • Djenka, You are banging your head on unplastered brickwall … he is a doctor in a public hospital and would not understand shit.

      • I meant ‘your’ as in you who pay the Medicare levy as in ‘your tax dollars’. Also for the record I don’t have strong views on abortion either way but I object to migrants being provided with scarce public resources for this purpose.

      • but I object to migrants being provided with scarce public resources for this purpose.

        Well do you object then immigrants paying taxes?
        it’s either you have your cake or you eat your cake…
        If *anyone* pays prescribed taxes, pays prescribed levies and additional insurances if applicable (s)he contributes to Australian society and Medicare more than those on permanent dole, those that evades paying taxes or had 0 workforce participation.

    • I’m not keen on recent migrants getting full Medicare benefits. I think they should be phased in over 10 years once they have built up some history of paying tax and putting something into the system.

      When I moved to Europe I had private healthcare paid in part by my employer. I didn’t suck benefits out of the local Irish system. Even if I did have an Irish passport. It seems wrong.

      • It would be interesting to know Medicare usage for those that get PR confirmed overseas, then come to Australia.

        Would it be wrong for new arrivals to not get Medicare entitlements for their first 5 years, get them to pay for private health insurance in the interim?

        Also temporary visa holders should not be given free education for their children, that should be private set up as well.

      • I don’t look at it as right or wrongm I look at the sustainability of the system as being the most important.

      • It would be interesting to know Medicare usage for those that get PR confirmed overseas, then come to Australia.
        Those that acquire PR overseas have generally better health than average person. Medical tests are stiff and detailed.

        Would it be wrong for new arrivals to not get Medicare entitlements for their first 5 years,

        Would it be wrong to give tax rebates to those that pay full taxes as everyone but have been bared access to a tax funded service?
        Is it wrong that someone takes some sort of insurance and claim the very next day?

        What separates barbaric countries is the lack of public health system available to every resident.
        I wish I can pay my medicare surcharge levy to Medicare instead of Medibank… and it should be progressively higher and with the lower threshold.

  21. I’m gonna upgrade from vibrancy to pure what the actual F …:

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-11/building-the-filipino-dream-in-outback-western-australia/1007595

    What wonderful dream has been realised by these hard working Filipinos in remote Australia you ask? Well it turns out to be streamlining the process of sending money back home.

    Mostly the Filipinos sending money to our country for helping the family — it’s a normal tradition in the Philippines, said Mabel Shanahan, president of the local Filipino club that organised the event.

    Some of them only send once a month, some of them twice a month.

    Some of them, especially the skilled workers, they send twice a week.

    Without the remittances of overseas Filipino workers, our economy will really slide down, said Ronhalee Asuncion, a labour academic at the University of the Philippines.

    So what about the alleged benefit to the Australian economy of having all of these extra people clogging up the place?? It is no consolation that this is going on in a relatively uncrowded part of Australia (though lord knows the remittance booths in Harris Park / Merrylands / Cabramatta do a roaring trade funneling money out of the Australian economy and over to India / Lebanon / Vietnam), because these small towns rely on local spending to support businesses. And these people wonder why the local bank closed!!

    I wonder how popular work visas would be in this country if there was a rule that you were not allowed to remit money overseas and had to spend it in Australia. Of course, then the Government would have to stop giving migrants advice about how to bleed the economy dry, as they are at present:

    https://www.moneysmart.gov.au/life-events-and-you/families/sending-money-overseas

    If you have friends or family overseas, you’re likely to want to send them money at some point: for a wedding, a medical expense or just to help with everyday expenses.

    • My Sunday morning was going so well. Think I need to head to the range for some soothing gunfire.

    • I have quite a few filo friends and totally understand why they have to do this, but also wonder about the effect this has on our economy given the sheer numbers of migrants from 3rd world economies. In a small town it’s really important to keep the velocity of money ticking over and sending it overseas kills it dead.
      I had the pleasure once of entering an 2 bedroom apartment housing 5 indians (all IT workers). Their apartment was completely bare of furniture. Bare mattresses lay on the floor and some broken furniture was around. They said they send all the money back home and in 5 years time they would be able to build their own Taj Mahal.
      So what benefit were they to our economy? I am sure they are not the only ones doing it. Not everyone wants to come here and start a new life. Some just see it as an opportunity to suck on our economic teat and drain it.

      • Try to put yourself in their shoes. In that same small town, everything is ten times more expensive than back in India. The big part is probably rent that small business pays. What would you do?

    • This is nothing new. I grew up in Darwin many many years ago and it was common knowledge the Greeks, Italians, Vietnamese, Chinese etc sent money home supporting family, friends and holiday homes.

  22. daily index shows prices falling 0.05% in Sydney. Can one of the fellow tards annualise this for me pls. I am way too tarded to do it myself.

    • I am now annualising EVERYTHING. Life is awesome. Every day is a Sunday. I will work 0 hours annually and still collect a full time wage. Avocados on special at the supermarket: I will be buying 1460 of them this year. And Sydney house prices down 18%.

  23. ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

    @Fisho and Gunna

    My Hot water Pronouncements

    Customer management (not having your time wasted) is a big part of what advice is served.
    Many customers are fully focused on up front cost, unable or not wanting to wait 4, 5 or 6 years (or more) to recoup the difference between a kettle like element heater changeover, costing around $1200 – $1600, compared to a solar setup that can cost over 5k.
    As for plumbers not recomending smaller heaters for pensioners,…a “same for same” changeover (size and brand) involves the lowest labor cost,…no stuffing around with pipe work, literally in and out in around an hour (more time soent draining the tank than doing the actual job).
    As a one man band with few overheads, I simply put $500 on my materials cost (heater, tempering valve, fittings etc) and win most of my HW enquiries, if I am beaten on price, its usually only just, to one of the specialist HW companies that buy their heaters wholesale for 100s of dollars cheaper than I can get them.
    They have their own trucks that come and deliver the heater and take the old one away and run very efficient opperations,…one of their employees could be changing out up to 6 or 7 heaters per day.
    These companies are extremely expensive though when it comes to any kind of pipework change, relocation or different kind of hot water system.
    They almost never quote the required tempering valve requirement (supposed to be changed every 5 years but never are unless failing) and are always hitting up the customer for another couple of hundred after winning the job.

    I have fitted smaller heaters for off peak using clients a number of times, replacing a 315 or 400 litre heater with a 250l one but only for really price sensitive clients like 2 pensioners living alone,…I always ask about visitor stayovers, numbers usage patterns etc a 250 is to small on off peak for 4 people.
    I had one crusty older guy in his late 60s who spends half his time riding motorcycles around the country, insist I install a cheap 80 or 125 L HWH on his off peak, telling me he only showers a few times a week and lives alone,…..So under protest I put in a 125 for him,….only saved him 100 bucks.
    The next owners wont be impressed.

    Remember that we plumbers make our money from Doing the job,…not offering a consulting service.

    Large families with heavy HW usage are better of in the long run, spending extra up front for solar/instantaneous gas boosted to ensure hot water on demand.
    But why would the pensioner like the one that I recently changed out a 400l hwh, for a 315,…for themselves and their single mum daughter and child and that have a $90/quarter off peak electricity bill (from their old 400l HWH ! They showed me their bill) Want to spend 5 or 6 grand more for a more “efficient ” solar gas boosted system.

    Ive actually got a good friend with 3 daudhters a son, wife and himself, along with an international student half the time and he gets by with a 315l off peak system that I also changed over from a 400l,…only runs out of HW a couple of times per year,..their property does have very low rate of water flow though, so a similar sized family might not cope with his set up in a higher flow house hold,…it makes a big difference.
    Much to jacobs approval,…I always remove the flow restrictor from new shower heas installs, but had a recent villa house customer call me back because her teenage daughter was running out all the hot water in their 50l HWH,…it only takes half an hour to heat up again,…but they didn’t run out mid shower with the flow restructor in,….sigh,…like all plumbers I hate call backs, usual don’t get paid for them,…thats why we generally loathe to put in HW heaters that are to small , we get called back when they run out of HW.
    As for heat pumps,…I loath them,…heavy and difficult to install, they are awfully fault prone and because they take so long to heat the water are unsuitable for of peak,…so although they use less electricity to make the water hot,….full time power costs eat up the bill savings when compared to off peak.
    See my detailed contempt for these units here,
    https://www.productreview.com.au/p/rheem-heat-pump.html

    At my place I put in Gas instantaneous and heat and cook with with it as well, but Im pissed off with my increasing Gas bill (the bloody kids spend ages in the shower and the boys not even at wanking age yet!)
    Im going to install solar HW in the next few years, but am undecided on whether to go Gas boosted or off peak element boosted.
    In Sydney where freezing pannells aren’t really a problem, I recomend the, on its side, tank above the pannels where the heated water is moved into the mains pressure tank via convection, ie no pump.
    Like the origional “Solarheart” brand you see everywhere, with a Stainless steel or copper tank, I come across these units still working, that were installed in the 80s!.
    But in colder areas you need to use remote pannels with pumps, sensors, controllers and glycol filled pannels and the heat exchanger pipework in a ground positioned tank.
    I have changed the pump in several Rheem water filled, Roof pannels pumped to ground positioned tank systems,…all were under 7 years old,…the pump is $500 plus my install of around $250 on a unit that cost 1000s more than a simple element heater that’ll give you 12 years trouble free if its vitreous enamel,…or 30 if its Stainless Steel (element thermostat change is only about $150-200 maybe once every 10 years on average)

    Ive been getting a lot of enquiries about instantaneous electric HWH of late but rarely come across them,…the decent units require 3 phase power and most people opt for sonething else.
    Ive only replaced a couple of them with the same (stiebel eltrons)
    My Uncle had an old electro mechanical Hocking electric instantaneous HWH that was installed when the house was built in 1966, he replaced it less than 10 years ago! and only because the bathroom reno guy talked him into it,…it was still working!
    Ive got a similar unit I removed from another job in my garage,…bloody work of art.
    If your super frugal Gunna and live in a cold area the Instantenous electric might be the go, …they are widespread in europe, but I don’t know if a battery setup could handle the amps these 12+kw units draw.

    Another thing with solar HW,…Im to old and fat to install them on 2 story houses anymore,…I only ever recomend them on easy access Single story dwellings,…a Plumbers gotta be able to make a quid.

    Anyway there is my 2 bobs worth.

  24. We had instant gas (mains) and cooking at our old unit in Perth, we were paying stupid bills (two of us) I read that the mainline gas is meant to be metered compressed but as it gets hotter outside the gas evaporates in the pipes and by the time it hit the meter it was decompressed?? Well we live in a fifth wheel now travelling and have an instant gas van heater, it was OK but struggled in winter I put a 5kw small under sink eBay induction heater in front and now we have full power house pressure boiling hot shower, the wife takes half an hour showers, cooking almost every day too. We barely use $23 gas (8.5kg) a month. There are AC units (split inductor) that run straight off 6 or more panels, no converter it’s built into the outside box, fantastic, but switch to mains at night. It would be great to have panels directly into a HWS just the same. I was looking at micro solar setups, one set and converter to the kitchen one set to the bathroom, laundry etc. you would do your washing during the day. When I get settled we are looking for a block with creek for a micro hydro setup (not paddle wheel but high pressure divert, they are great and can at least power a couple of houses using a reverse pool pump.

    • Nope. Mains gas doesnt work like that at all. No idea where you got that information from, but its one of the weirdest ones ive heard. The only thing that comes close to what you are saying is if the main gas is high pressure and you have a regulator just before the meter. But the evaporating in heat etc is way off the mark.

    • Mining BoganMEMBER

      Are you saying that Barry Plant bloke who told me that rents never drop and nobody ever lowballs in Melbourne lied to me?

      I am shocked and appalled.

      • Barry bloody headplant. I have had fun dealing with them on a property deal. Reneg at last minute etc.. those bastards and Ray White. Pour kerosene all over the office, dead lock the doors and set it on fire would be a merciful way of dealing with the lot of em’..

      • Two houses in my Melb street, and both had been on the market for over two months. One is still empty, and the one next to me just rented this last week after the owner did weeks of upgrades. Maybe they are priced too high? I know never to ask a RE agent as they just BS to you.

      • Is there an element of people not wanting to rent to migrants that will cram a small village into a place?

    • Not that I dont think its great, im having a hard time thinking of why the rental market is softening in syd/melb. Where have all the punters gone? Or are they all moving into skykennels? Anyone got a plausable senario?

      • Net migration from Syd is actually negative despite all the new vibrant arrivals, as Sydney people leave for other Aus cities that are less expensive and farked.

      • Gav the relationship doesn’t really work that way: rents = wages.House prices don’t drive rents, although in a sensible functioning market (ie not Sydney) rents are a driver of house prices.

      • Arrow I agree but my on the ground experience in Ireland and here seems to reflect what I said. I have a couple of theories why…

        1. High prices mean more choose to rent over buy. So would be buyers bid up to rent houses in more desirable areas.

        2. Since there are more renters, landlords can charge more, especially for dumps as many get priced out of nicer places.

        3. More people share and split the rent which means landlords can squeeze more per person.

        4. When prices are falling, landlords focus more on rental returns and therefore are scared to boot tenants out because they can’t afford the gap in income the same.

        5. Some people have less money to spend due to less available work and decide to either move in with others or parents which drives less demand for rental stock.

        6. Like you say there is more people moving to other regions as they have had enough. If I lose my job in Sydney I would be gone tomorrow. I’m sick of it. I think many others are also.

        In Ireland crashing prices meant no more queues to inspect a rental property and rents came down at least 20-30% in prime locations (Dublin 6) / Rathmines area I was.. (recommend it).

        Just my experience I’m sure it’s more complex than that, but what I’ve observed.

      • Gav I think you’re right. I had made the mistake of thinking your equals sign meant one-directional causation, but I think they are instead correlated just as you describe.

      • The largest component of NOM are international students from China who actually prefer sky kennels. It is what they are familiar with. Suburban share house isn’t their bag. Traditional Australians who prefer lifestyle with a backyard are leaving Syd.

        There may also be some previously empty stock coming back onto the rental market. Developers who have landbanked empty houses for the purposes of development might be renting them now that sky kennel sales have come off. This is speculation, it would be interesting to understand this dynamic better….

      • Is it also possible that some of those empty appartments, that Chinese kept as new, are starting to list?

  25. The disgrace that is Greg Jericho reaches new levels
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/grogonomics/2018/aug/12/blaming-a-rising-population-is-easy-finding-solutions-is-hard-but-it-can-be-done

    Methinks that the big Australia boosters are worried. Parliament is back this week for the first time since the Longman by election. The days of the coalition party room following ‘the leadership’ on immigration and corporate tax cuts is done as they can all see the doom to which ‘the leadership’ is taking them. This article is an example of the big Australian people getting out early in an attempt to shape what is coming.

    • Strategic defection, and you get a ringside view. It’ll be quite a show too, hope you have stocked up on popcorn. Slowly, slowly, elites will start to defect from the current factional structure, to something new. As the size of the incoming sh!tstorm becomes obvious, and no one will believe that the government has any idea what to do, and the system will struggle to find new stable equilibria.

      For my money, we might actually see a Green-OneNation alliance. Especially if the militant green faction reemerges, and teams up with the nationalists of ON. A right wing green party – it promises to be quite exciting.

      I suspect an era of political gridlock is coming soon, which will only exacerbate the crisis, until everything goes kaboom, and then we see an era of political innovation. Very promising, all in all, unless you work in FIRE.

      • Please stop you’re making me horny lol… I haven’t read anything so erotic since 70s playboy mags (which I only read for car reviews and tobacco ads.

    • noted the piss weak cop out at the end.
      Finding Solutions is hard, but that is why pollies are paid…FMD the stupid trite cvnt has no clue himself and goes Pontius Pilate

  26. Like an un-flushable turd which keeps resurfacing, Sam Dastyari eyes a comeback with a mia culpa sob story.
    https://www.9news.com.au/national/2018/08/12/08/40/dastyari-recalls-post-resignation-darkness

    Dastari conventionally omits that he was having personal bills paid for by a CCP united front player and claims that his error was ‘managing party contributions’ as a member of the Sentate. Slime slime slime.

    Make no mistake, he is after a comeback. What would a slime bag like Dasyari do but politics? Is isn’t like he actually has any skills that make him employable outside politics.

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Dasyari fked up,…he rose to far, to fast, to young.
      Id be happy to see him redeem himself though.
      Inspite of my better judgment,… I like him.

      The only way to eliminate said shennangians, is to keep ALL our elected representatives on tight leashes,…controlled by their respective rank and file party faithfuls.
      Once you let individuals “run free” with power,…it ALWAYS corrupts them.

  27. Games Corner

    I’ve played Scythe a few times now and can recommend it. You will need very patient people the for first time players. Once the rules are known it moves quite briskly. There’s no dice and it combines the American and European style of gaming well. one of the fun things is that it isn’t always obviously who will win the game. This leads to some fantastic post game tantrums.

    https://boardgamegeek.com/boardgame/169786/scythe

    • Those morons elect judges.
      This sounds like a massively stupid idea to begin with.
      As for impeaching them all in one hit on charges like converting a historic desk for personal use, that is what tin-pot 3rd word dictators do to judges they don’t like.

      • interested party

        haha…yeah…I won’t even try to pretend I know how their system works… but impeaching the whole lot, good grief.

    • There are people out there who just need shooting.
      – Father of a daughter (birthday today) and two sons.

      • interested party

        I hope she had a great day.
        Our kids are our future…they need protection.

        Bullets are too good for these types.

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      Grubby tweets for sure,….but is he a pedo apologist or just a fkwit trying to gain some cheap laughs by being overtly vulgar and guttural,…there is a massive difference.

      The only reason I even posted this reply is because of the suspect motivies of this guy,

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_Cernovich

      In July 2018, he publicized historical tweets in which director James Gunn, a critic of Trump, had joked about rape and pedophilia; Gunn was fired by Disney as a result.[47]

      Conflict with Sam Seder
      I believe this tweet was posted when Polanski was seeking to return to the US. I wrote that tweet out of disgust with those who were excusing or were seeking to advocate forgiveness for Polanski’s actions which caused him to flee the US. I was appalled that anyone would diminish the seriousness of rape, particularly of a child by citing the perpetrator’s artistic contributions. Obviously, I would not wish any harm of my daughter or any other person.

      I am confident that other tweets from that time will reflect my disgust in a less satirical tone.
      — Sam Seder in an email to MSNBC Senior VP of Communications Errol Cockfield Jr., defending the tweet.[48]
      On November 28, 2017, Cernovich published a post on Medium[49] which resurfaced a deleted 2009 tweet made by progressive talk radio host and MSNBC political commentator Sam Seder, in which he joked about convicted child rapist and fugitive film director Roman Polanski.[50][51][52] The tweet read, “Don’t care re Polanski, but I hope if my daughter is ever raped it is by an older truly talented man w/ a great sense of mise en scène.”[49][50][52] Cernovich insisted the tweet proved Seder tacitly endorsed Polanski’s pedophilia.[48][49][50] He then approached multiple journalists and news outlets, including MSNBC, to break the story.[50][53]

      Despite explaining the tweet to MSNBC Senior VP of Communications Errol Cockfield Jr. via email, on December 4, 2017, TheWrap announced that MSNBC had elected to sever ties with Seder by not renewing his contract (due to expire in February 2018) due to the controversial tweet.[48][50][51] Seder defended the tweet by pointing out that, taken in context of the current events around the time he posted it, it was a satiric response to a petition urging Polanski’s release from detention in Switzerland.[51][53][54] That he was, in fact, mocking Polanski’s apologists.[48][50][55] After news of the termination broke, Cernovich released a Twitter video celebrating his triumph.[50][N 1]

      By then, Seder noted that advertisers on The Majority Report with Sam Seder podcast were also being contacted and pressured by Cernovich and his team to cut ties with the show over the tweet.[50] In response, Seder launched a GoFundMe campaign to ensure the show is funded if the advertisers decided to bail.[50] In an episode of the podcast titled, “I’m Under Attack By the Nazi Alt-Right”, Seder said, “this smear involves the willful misinterpretation of a tweet that I posted in 2009” and that he will “never be ashamed of criticizing those who would excuse the predation of women or girls.”[48][51] Seder also revealed plans to use a portion of the GoFundMe proceeds to produce a three-minute video educating people on Cernovich’s tactics.[50] He surmised this was retribution for his frequent criticism of US President Donald Trump as well as Republican Alabama Senate candidate Roy Moore.[51][53][N 2] Further, Seder chided MSNBC’s decision to terminate his employment concluding, “I think they’re afraid of those people.”[48][N 3]

      This was mind-bogglingly stupid, a real textbook case of how not to handle ‘controversy’ […] Seder was taking the side of abuse victims.
      — The Washington Post reporter David Weigel on MSNBC’s decision to fire Seder.[50]
      The news of Seder’s dismissal received immediate backlash.[50][51][56] Over 12,000 people signed a petition protesting Seder’s termination, arguing that Cernovich had acted in malice and was deliberately mischaracterizing the tweet.[53][57] Multiple news publications pilloried MSNBC.[N 4][N 5] MSNBC primetime anchor Chris Hayes tweeted, “The entire culture and our politics are now dominated by people who have weaponized bad faith and shamelessness.”[58] Hayes tweeted several times against the decision by his own network, including: “Also, I reiterate my longstanding position that people shouldn’t be fired for a tweet, *particularly* one that is obviously being read in manifestly bad faith.”[53][60] Actress Sarah Silverman also tweeted in support of Seder.[N 6]

      There was considerable dissent within MSNBC over the termination.[50][54] Employees worried firing Seder incentivized other far-right personalities to launch similar campaigns.[50][54] MSNBC’s management itself was unsettled by the celebratory reaction from the far-right.[50][54] On December 7, 2017, MSNBC decided to reverse their decision to terminate Seder’s employment. MSNBC President Phil Griffin said in a statement, “Sometimes you just get one wrong, and that’s what happened here. We made our initial decision for the right reasons—because we don’t consider rape to be a funny topic to be joked about. But we’ve heard the feedback, and we understand the point Sam was trying to make in that tweet was actually in line with our values, even though the language was not. Sam will be welcome on our air going forward.”[57][61] In response, Seder issued a statement while accepting his job back:

      I appreciate MSNBC’s thoughtful reconsideration and willingness to understand the cynical motives of those who intentionally misrepresented my tweet for their own toxic, political purposes […] We are experiencing an important and long overdue moment of empowerment for the victims of sexual assault and of reckoning for their perpetrators. I’m proud that MSNBC and its staff have set a clear example of the need to get it right.[55][61]

      If you decide to let this guy be the arbiter of what is and is not appropriate, understand who he is.
      — Sam Seder, on the three-minute video he plans to produce on Cernovich.[50]
      Columbia Journalism Review cited the incident as an example of a broader pattern of far-right media personalities using online smear campaigns to get mainstream journalists fired.[62] Cernovich, for his part, acknowledged that “some are saying Seder was making a joke or being sarcastic.”[50][51] However, he still insisted he didn’t misrepresent the tweet.[50] He later admitted that the whole incident was a stunt[N 7] while claiming victory explaining, retroactively, it was meant to bring attention to what he perceived was a double standard and a lack of “diversity of viewpoint” in the media,[57] He also tweeted that he was “thrilled” MSNBC offered Seder his job back while threatening to “bring Sam Seder’s Tweet out every time the media goes after someone else for a Tweet.”[N 8] On December 9, 2017, having failed to get Seder fired, Cernovich claimed that his wife was being stalked at the behest of the media.[63]

  28. Population Spruik by “Councillor Nicholas Reece is chair of planning for the City of Melbourne”
    Apparently everyone against the policy has got it horribly wrong. He must be a real genius.

    We need him checked out to see his property interests, and given he’s the planning guy, like the Mayor I’ll bet he’s got all the time in the world for his developer mates.

    https://www.theage.com.au/national/victoria/it-s-getting-crowded-around-here-and-that-s-a-good-thing-20180810-p4zwnu.html?loginAction=%5Bobject%20Object%5D#comments

    • It’s getting crowded around here, and that’s a good thing??????? WTF????

      Let’s see what the VIC/NSW/Federal elections to be held in the next 12 months bring on this issue

    • Even StevenMEMBER

      To make matters worse, Mr Reece labels everyone who doesn’t agree with a Big Australia as ‘rabble rousers’.

  29. TailorTrashMEMBER

    Walking past a chemist shop today …..big sign says ….”sick certificate $27.95 “ ……..nice to see the great Aussie sickie has been financialised by the pharmacy guild
    …….I’m sure they would upsell you on the cough medicine too for a nice little earner ………………….what does our RMO think of this ?…eh d672 ?

    • It does seem quite cynical but time is money. Better than queuing up half the day at a medical centre so that a doctor can confirm the obvious.

    • ErmingtonPlumbingMEMBER

      “the 500,000 overseas students in Australia mean most immigrants on average are better educated than many born here.”

      As a parent This as a supporting argument for a higher end rate fills me with anger.

    • LOL at “agents protecting the value of the home” – protecting their own commissions more likely. Of course, if access to funds continues to be a challenge, we’ll soon see statements about vendors needing to lower their expectations.