Links 16 December 2019

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Leith van Onselen
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    • something else is more interesting here, why this shift to the right of poorer and less educated “working class’ people happens only in UK, Australia and USA but not in other western countries, not even all of English speaking countries Canada, NZ or Ireland?
      Also why would more educated and wealthier people simultaneously shift toward the “left” (mostly fake left but regardless away from their traditional right wing positions)
      what makes these countries different, and what makes these two groups different?

      how about we have a look into media dominance in these countries – these three (UK, USA and Aus) have mainstream media dominated by brainwashing Murdoch media empire that creates a content that appeals more to less educed and poorer population.
      So maybe what Downer say that “progressives” fail pub test is right but only because test is being rigged by Murdoch to deliver results he wants. It’s hard to fail to see an axis between Abbott (later Scomo) – Trump – Johnson election victories and even harder to see old Murdoch at one end spinning it

      • So you’re suggesting the actual policies have nothing to do with why working class people have voted away from the ALP. Instead they were swayed by media. Seems unlikely to me.

        • what policies? they are not policies they are false promises promoted or turned around and condemned by media
          an average worker has no idea what policies there are, what their impact would be and how would that affect their lives.

          Also the other side is not much different so people feel betrayed.

          basically people have choice of coke and pepsi with coke having much better media machinery in Murdoch dominated countries

          • The fake right are equally as bad as the fake left. Morrison is full of p1ss and wind. The MYEFO is a classic example of spin over substance, it’s an art the right have mastered and will also be their eventual demise.

      • I suppose NZ had National Party while we had Labor, same with Canada, they had Harper while we had Labor… at the same time US had Obama… just at different stages in our own cycles.

    • The problem is what people are saying about “progressives” at the pub is generally what they read in the newspaper or on their facebook feeds, which rarely has any resemblence to reality.

      • Flammable Cladding

        They were not forced to come here, they sought and were granted refugee protection and given financial assistance by the Australian Government taxpayers.

        I am not expecting them to be eternally grateful, but if they have regrets about the whole process and their outcomes, it is high time to rethinking what we are doing, since it is not really making anyone happy.

        The victims of a home invasion in Melbourne last year that was committed by South Sudanese might agree. In fact I will tell you that they do agree – they are known to me via a work colleague.

        • what it means “not being forced”, when someone has his/her life under direct threat it’s hard to talk about free will

          I think they are not happy, neither are some people around them; they have regrets but there s again very little most of them can do – their choices are quite limited.
          Western countries are largely to blame for the mess there and than things didn’t go well when western countries came to help again by offering people to escape. Things are never as simple as they came here because they wanted and now are ruining our communities.

          While home invasion in Melbourne are numerous they are small thing compared to other crimes that cause less anger, for example wage theft loses worth billions of dollars a year, yet none is recommending expelling business owners and executives who committed those thefts.

          • The British left Sudan in 1956, i.e. before the vast majority of Sudanese were even born. You are effectively denying that the Sudanese have agency and thus some responsibility for the mismanagement of their country. Perhaps the British didn’t have agency either, because of the Norman Conquest or their civil war in the 1600s.

            Home invasions would be absolutely terrifying, even without physical violence. Your family clearly hasn’t suffered from one. No doubt many of us (including me) would be delighted if the wage thieves could be deported. Unfortunately, we have signed international agreements that prevent us from making people stateless, so this would only be possible for foreigners or people with dual citizenship. We could settle for confiscation of their property and significant jail time.

          • Sudan got independence from British in 1956, that doesn’t mean that British left and it also doesn’t mean Sudan should have been a single (or two or three) countries at the first place
            the very fact that British left people who live there with a country organised in a European nation state style is enough to blame them for everything that happened afterwards. What we westerners cannot understand is that not everyone wants or needs to have a country organised the same way we want, or to have a central government at all …

            On the other subject, you are also not thinking about emotional stress and domestic violence caused by wage theft. Also, there are probably 10 million dual citizens in Australia, with large majority of those running businesses falling in this category. We are not deporting wage thieves because we cannot but because we see them as job creators (jobs without pay)

          • The British left Sudan in 1956, i.e. before the vast majority of Sudanese were even born. You are effectively denying that the Sudanese have agency and thus some responsibility for the mismanagement of their country. Perhaps the British didn’t have agency either, because of the Norman Conquest or their civil war in the 1600s.

            Home invasions would be absolutely terrifying, even without physical violence. Your family clearly hasn’t suffered from one.

            That’s some weapons-grade irony right there.

  1. Inflammation of the brain chiken coops in the sky death of the aussie pie you got money and we will extract it no backyard you have to buy and get more Inflammation on the brain for dog sake let it rain faken Inflammation of the brain