I quite like Rob Oakeshott. He doesn’t treat us like dills and has a decent grasp of economics. But God, where’s this bloody been since he was elected?
From Radio National this morning (listen online or download):
The Gillard government is resisting pressure to redesign its mining tax after it raised just $126 million—a fraction of the $2 billion forecast for the current financial year.
Independent MP Rob Oakeshott, along with the Greens is urging the prime minister and the treasurer to renegotiate the tax with the states to close some loopholes.
Here’s the direct MP3 link (right click and save as): bst_20130212_0753
Rent Seekers clearly hold the power in this country and they even have their ugly foot soldiers spewing their propaganda here.
I have no issues with vested interests per say, after all every voter has a vested interest in something. It’s the disproportionate representation that money can buy that I have a major problem with.
The fact that all sides of politics continually fail to put in place any meaningful mechanisms to manage lobbyists, vested interests leaves one question the integrity of our political system.
Oh god. HnH, this is just a juicy bait for another round of right wing commentators whinging and bringing that old furphy about how Oaky betrayed his allegedly conservative electorate after the 2010 elections. (He didn’t.. see below)
In his first term (2007), Oakeshott voted 32 times with the ruling Labor government (including in support of the proposed emission trading scheme) and nine times with the opposition. He has explained that this record was not indicative of support for Labor’s policy platform, but rather because he believed in allowing governments to govern.
Source: Wikipedia.
It’s also a very important issue that has not so far been aired by anyone in power.
What?
Yeah, I was just precluding the obfuscating hand wavers from drawing attention away from the topic
Mav do you have an opinion on Oakeshott’s ramble or are you too busy handwaving and engaging in diversionary behaviour.
Oakeshott is a great independent MP. We should have more people like him in the Parliament, working on issues that matter rather than the endless politicking and representing only the vested interests.
Indeed. The Parliament will be poorer when Oakeshott and Windsor are gone, and replaced by faceless men from the LNP and ALP.
As is often the case, the Greens are portrayed has the lunatic fringe, but they’re the only ones with sensible policy proposals to fix the MRRT.
(and before the MineBot responds, we all know how you would like to “fix” the MRRT. Repeal!)
Pot. Kettle.
Your mentioning Oakeshott’s ramble is engaging in diversionary behaviour. Please try to stick to the topic = Oakeshott’s purporting to want the (treasonous) MRRT 2.0 redesigned.
I say “purporting”, because the supposed focus on working with the States to close the “royalties” loophole is another diversionary tactic (not by you 3d), that conveniently sidesteps the issues of far greater import -
1. A popularly elected PM dumped from office, only after his deputy was “given the nod” by a foreign-owned multinational monolith to do so, in exchange for stopping their politically damaging anti-MRRT PR campaign.
2. An immediate, secret, behind closed doors redesign of the MRRT, negotiated exclusively between the new PM and her treacherous deputy, and the Big 3 (and only the Big 3) foreign-owned multinationals.
3. The Big 3 publicly stating that they were “happy” with the new deal.
4. Government (and the treasonous Goose in particular) embarking on a vociferous campaign of public vilification – not of the Big 3 – but instead, of those Australian miners who were locked out of the MRRT 2.0 negotiations, and who were clearly disadvantaged (vs their multinational oligopoly competitors), in commercial competitive terms, by the redesigned scheme.
5. Government refusal to provide any details of the assumptions underpinning the redesigned (by the Big 3) multinationals, citing “commercial in confidence”.
6. Government reneging on pledge to provide monthly updates of MRRT 2.0 revenue received.
7. Oakeshott himself voting for the newly redesigned, Big 3 multinational favouring MRRT 2.0.
It’s about time MB took a closer look also at the details of the MRRT which appear to provide a loophole for tax minimisation by the Big 3 in the event of their using their considerably greater financial muscle to buy up locally-owned competitors and juniors. Might just help explain why the likes of Twiggy, Palmer and Gina weren’t happy.
Just so Op8.
Good post.
Redeisng doesn’t need to occur.
Implementation o Ken Henry’s tax plan will suffice.
Thats rich coming from a paid astroturfer.
You’ve had your say 3d1k, let others form their own opinion.
A short summary is always appreciated.
Oakeshott in full campaign mode!
C’mon, he’s grabbed an issue that generates a bit of publicity and he likes his face in the public square.
He clearly fails to understand the myriad benefits the mining investment boom has already brought to our economy – he should read a little Bob Gregory and Max Corden.
The inclusion of Royalties pay-back in the MRRT was in recognition that the original Henry Tax Review recommended a broad based resource rent tax as a replacement for a number of other taxes including Royalties.
Oakeshott knows full well that the resource States will be be reluctant to cede Royalty revenue streams to the Government – regardless of what happy shiny face Griener and his crew put on it. There is a long way to go on that issue, States have very limited means of independently raising revenues, Royalties are important.
If the RSPT/MRRT had not been used solely as a tax grab but negotiated sensibly with States and the resource sector this could have been a very different tax indeed. Of course all these issues dudes like Oakeshott and Bandt are now upset about should have been determined, agreed upon and enacted prior to the rush of MRRT legislation.
Speak ‘o’ the Devil!
Are you referring to my new avatar
I am referring to your invasion of this public square.
+100 ..LOL . HnH comes down & pitch and hits 3d1k for a six.
+ 1
How does one shape shift the avatar on here?
Mod: gravatar.com
Ta…but can’t get it to work on MB
On the same subject I simply cannot change my profile at all. Whenever I go to the top left hand corner of the page to ‘edit my profile’ it simply reloads the MB home page page, same if i click the wordpress stuff on top left of the page. Any ideas?
“could have been a very different tax indeed”
Ain’t that an understatement…
C’mon 3d, why not shoot the horse the messenger rode in on as well? Given you lot take about as many prisoners as an assassination squad I have to thank you for the morning laugh.
Mod: are you hard of hearing? If you comment again on this thread, have the rest of the day off…
I wonder what wit we are missing…?
Chris Becker must be moderator today. He ruins every thread.
Ruins the thread only for your employers. Reducing the volume of your posts improves the thread for me.
Agree
Im going of my own accord.
and pipe down in future when told?!
Tell your employer that when I come into my dictatorship, he/she, along with all his/her executives, will be summarily deported, and assets nationalised.
Well I’m still wondering how 3d1k is abused as an ‘astroturfer’ (“Generating public excitement in a subject by posting anonymous comments to blogs, wikis and other public venues”) while others in here, clearly posting in their own organisation’s self-interest, are actively cheered on by all and sundry.
Further I’m not swallowing that number of posts baloney! That’s straight BS. 1. 3d1k posts a lot because that person is directly attacked a lot in way that as my old uncle would have said “It’s just not cricket” 2. There is pretty much no one else in this whole MB blog that defends the mining industry against what are often plainly misleading posts or tries to give a balanced view re the mining industry. That 3d1k posts a lot in response to the numerous outrageous attacks on the industry and some of its people is should hardly be surprising.
Like who ? Let’s have a rundown.
Given you are blind in one eye, can’t see out of the other, a totally closed mind and a heavy lean to the Left I’m not surprised by can’t see it.
Some examples: Peter Fraser, david collyer, Land Developer, Hugh Pavletich, Nathan whatsisname (sorry Nathan!) and possibly Bullion Baron. I expect there are more.
BTW, anyone mentioned above should not take this as a meaning I have a negative view of their contributions in any way. As far as I am concerned, all of them have an interesting and at times very useful perspective. All part of the rich tapestry of debate on MB. As is 3d1k, IMHO.
Alex, I might be biased, doctrinaire and vested, but I don’t deliberately try to deflect discussion and use up the comment thread’s valuable oxygen. Nor do I recite from the Tory phrasebook like 2d.
Oh, and:
Don’t Buy Now!
As I said, I value your contribution. You may think 3d1k is in a different category, and of course you are well entitled to that view. I just don’t share it.
I’m reasonably confident none of those posters have ever backed away from disclosing their vocations and any commercial motivations they might have. Or, at the very least, denying same.
3d1k in most discussions is just a seagull. Flys in, makes a lot of noise and shits all over everything, then flys away again when approached. Which is, after all, what he’s paid to do.
No-one as rusted-on, far-right-wing as you is in any position to lecture anyone about “bias”. To you anyone who thinks a welfare safety net and publicly funded healthcare and schooling are good ideas has “a heavy lean to the Left”.
Your lack of integrity is shown by the selective quoting of astroturfing above. The important part that you left out was:
“Generating public excitement in a subject by posting anonymous comments to blogs, wikis and other public venues. Astroturfing looks like spontaneous comments from different people but is really an orchestrated campaign by an organization or public relations firm.“
I fully agree with you Flawse. 3d1k IS bollocked here to an extent that just is not cricket. I find quite a lot of his/her comments interesting, and (often) thought provoking. His/her bias’ are transparent – as are most our own
And importantly, he/she is invariably polite and courteous – moreso than myself, alas.
However …
Where the specific topic of the mining tax is the subject under discussion, then given 3d1k’s self-admitted biases, and in light the grave import of the topic – in particular, considering that it revolves around duplicity, corruption, and treason (yes, treason) at the highest levels of governance of the nation – it is my view that any and (nearly) all bollocking is fair game.
Especially so if 3d1k is an Australian citizen.
“all bollocking is fair game. ”
Not from cowardly positions of anonymity with what amounts to obscene abuse based on ignorance.
3″d1k doesn’t have to remain anonymous, he is quite free to put a name to his ignorance.
” treason (yes, treason)”
My hyperbole detector just blew a fuse.
RP … lol.
trea·son
[tree-zuhn]
noun
1. the offense of acting to overthrow one’s government or to harm or kill its sovereign.
2. a violation of allegiance to one’s sovereign or to one’s state.
3. the betrayal of a trust or confidence; breach of faith; treachery.
O8, if you did not intend meaning 1, you would have been better advised to use one of the perfectly good available alternatives such as treachery or betrayal.
Instead, you chose to use treason, and emphasise your point by repeating it.
Back to year 12 English for you.
As per Oz journalist Paul Cleary, BHP handed over negative private polling data to Karl Bitar to assist the faceless men to roll over Rudd., even as the public Newspoll was still favourable to Rudd.
John Faulkner and a number of Labor MPs have confirmed that negative polling was indeed circulated behind Rudd’s back.
If this private polling data indeed came from BHP, then Op8 is on the money re his treason charge.
Crap. There is a long way between dirty politics and treason.
Alex, don’t let us in on your standards of morality.
You seem to be missing one tiny detail, Mav. You can only betray someone if you were on their side to start with. Nobody in their right mind would think that BHP was “on Rudd’s side”, least of all him.
I smell a straw man. Who the F is talking about betrayal of Rudd??
Betrayal of the nation by a private multinational company meddling in the internal party/ political process, with the sole aim of sabotaging democratic principles and upending unfavourable public policy. The voters should have had to decide if RSPT was bad public policy and throw out Rudd/Labor. Instead we had a African Banana Republic style bloodless coup engineered by PR mercenaries/political hacks and bankrolled by private entities.
Mav, you really have lost it. Since when is meddling in the internal party/political process a betrayal of the nation? Get a grip.
Alex,
How does Gillard/Swan’s “rolling” of a popularly elected Prime Minister – at the behest of private foreign interests – not fit equally well with definitions 1. and 2.?
Your personal choice to view and portray the actions of Gillard/Swan as merely “dirty politics”, rather than the betrayal of a PM, overturning of a government, and screwing over the best interests of the citizenry in favour of pure unbridled self-interest in cahoots with and to the benefit of foreign interests, says more about your own personal morality than the accuracy or otherwise of my English.
The leader of the majority party is always, by custom, the PM. The majority party can change its leader at any time for any reason. PMs have been rolled by their party in the past on a number of occasions. I don’t recall anyone describing these incidents as treason, and I consider it an absurd description. And on another note, IMO anyone mentioning morality and politics in the same sentence has to be more than a little naive.
Of course, YMMV.
Again, don’t let us in on your standards.
If we apply your standards of morality to the Obeid/Ian McDonald saga, they weren’t betraying the people of NSW at all while were rolling over Premier after Premier who interfered with their private coal mining related activities. They were just employing ‘dirty politics’ to participate in a lawful business activity.
A false parallel. What Obeid and McDonald are alleged to have done was illegal. The rolling of Premiers is another matter entirely. The NSW ALP caucus is entitled to arrange its internal affairs however it sees fit. Of course, it has to answer to the voters and they have given their verdict – they don’t approve of the revolving door. I expect the voters to give the same verdict in the upcoming federal election.
But this is all a long way from “betrayal of the nation” and all that other hyperbolic claptrap you and Op8 have been trotting out.
Your expectation that BHP’s interests should coincide with Australia’s, or that BHP should not be expected to use all legal means possible to defend its interests, is exceptionally naive.
Finally, my expectations of what might happen in the political arena have nothing whatever to do with my personal morality, and it is offensive of you to suggest that it does.
This is my final word on the matter. Feel free to have the last say if you must.
Too far, sadly. We might see more decisions “in the best interests of the people” and less soft corruption if the people involved actually had something serious to lose.
Too far, sadly. We might see more decisions “in the best interests of the people” and less soft corruption if the people involved actually had something serious to lose.
I agree…
If found guilty, I see no reason for Eddie O’Beid to be allowed to live any further.
Not much more you can lose than that.
Your expectation that BHP’s interests should coincide with Australia’s, or that BHP should not be expected to use all legal means possible to defend its interests, is exceptionally naive.
All legal means, eh? More than my naivety, It is a reflection on Australia getting on the slippery slope to becoming a tinpot Banana Republic where a private entity can use “all legal means” to remove a PM they do not want, while you wink and crow about how worldly wise you are.
I, on the other hand, while only a recent resident of this country, will naively continue to support and encourage good, independent leaders like Robb Oakeshott.
“I, on the other hand, while only a recent resident of this country, will naively continue to support and encourage good, independent leaders like Robb Oakeshott.”
Fair enough. I have a fair bit of time for Mr Oakeshott too. More of his kind would improve the standard of our politics immensely.
With you on that one flawse, I don’t mind the Bots posts.
Interesting that the ABC journo didn’t react to the ‘public square’ statement. She (Fran?) did seem in a rush to get through a question list with news headlines looming but I was still expecting some acknowledgement of it.
Rob oakshott has been consistent, including his call for overall tax reform not just the MRRT.
I initially thought he was a bit of a dickhead with his 17 minutes speech, but have come to the opinion that he is of a far higher standard of MP and individual than the bulk of the labor, Libs and the Greens MP’s.
I wish he was my MP.
I hold Nick Xenophon in the same regard.
re 3D1k – let him back on, he is entertaining and consistent.
The RSPT (the Henry tax) was one of the silliest ideas ever to escape captivity.
Wayne Swan was browsing through the Henry Dream on the beach while on holiday in early 2010. Perhaps it was the sun, perhaps it was the sheer pleasure of relaxing, or perhaps he had come to mistake tax reform for beach cricket, but, strangely, he decided there and then that he wanted to open the batting for that Silliest Ever Idea.
He knew he could sell the RSPT to the Desperate Kev. Kev was a willing buyer. He would need no inducements. Everything about this looked fabulous to the Hollow Man. The Kev, who had lost his mojo in Copenhagen, needed something he could use to re-claim his standing as Great Warrior. The Silliest Ever Idea was beauty in his eyes. He could become its champion, and renew his claim to be A Fierce and Strong Patriot.
And so it came to pass that the Dopey Treasurer and the Frantic Kev bought into a Silly Dream. Thus armed with false intentions and mad pretexts – and with less than the bare minimum of planning or forethought – they promptly marched in the direction of Inevitable and Ignominious Defeat.
Later on, it became obvious that the vassals in the Mining Industry could and would pay more tax, and those Constitutional Relics, the States, decided, quite naturally, that in this case, they would help themselves to the Revenue.
So it was that Mad Kev armed only with a Silly Idea increased the Treasure of the States. What a strange twist to a holiday musing by a drowsy Swan.
Indeed. But the question is where have you been?
Oaky Dokey Oakshott 4 – Minerals Council of Australia Nil.
I’ve been diverted from my usual diet, HnH. I have been slimming. Only the occasional tidbit has passed these lips. And no more drink. I have been both sober and hungry. Now and then I have wandered past this Brasserie and inhaled the aromas – the creams and sauces, the herbs and meats and the sharp greens, the pistachio ices, flambes and cognacs – and surveyed all the customers, heeled and tailored, rowdy, quaffing, doubling their coffees and the cigars.
But I have been surviving on crusts and research, HnH.
I will call again and join the revels.
Oakeshott has a point about closing the loophole WRT state royalties. But the main reason the MRRT is raising less revenue than expected is that Treasury was badly out in its estimates of market value for current mines and its estimates of expected mine life. As a result, the depreciation allowance was greater than Treasury anticipated.
I don’t doubt the integrity of the three key independents – what they are learning is how to deal with the lying cheating vermin that run the major parties – don’t think they’ll be so naive if they get a second chance.
We should be taking good independents over the party patsies that just do the bidding of their faceless party leaders any day of the week.
NSW has shown that labor is sickeningly corrupt – to let them spin their way out of this one would be stupid. Just another empty brand trying to bullsh8t that the burger looks something like it does in the advert when really it is just a sloppy greasy vile mess put together by bored teenager that couldn’t give a rats arse.
“I don’t doubt the integrity of the three key independents”
Oh you jest.